Theists seem to think god solves this problem, but god is necessarily inside existence, which would always be the larger category. God cannot have made existence, because he would require a creation of his (existence) before he made it.
There isn't anything that could exist prior to existence, including god. meaning he couldn't have caused existence. Any first cause is an uncaused cause where energy poofed into existence from nothing. This is not the big bang, that's an "I don't know". the first cause like theists thing god is, is the actual nonsensical assertion about something coming from nothing.
and to be clear, there can't ever "be" a state of nothingness, for the state itself is something. another reason there can't have been a beginning to existence.
Special EPhex2019-08-02T08:13:39Z
That is a quandary you imposed yourself, and for you to figure out and resolve, not theists. You cannot seem to distinguish the theist's idea of God from you're own (whether you believe in Him or not), and pose a question that is irrelavant to the theist's idea of God, and only applies to you're own. It is no different from the logic that assumes, "man came from apes", explains evolution. How do you explain what evolution is to someone who has the wrong idea of what it intends to infer?
If you do not accept the theist idea of God, fine, I am just telling you you're misrepresenting the theist's idea of God, and should be taking issue with you're interpretation of it. I very well understand you're line of questioning, which is good deductive reasoning, but it only pertains to the "god you're describing", not the theist's idea of God. You're not representing God as theist do, so you're gonna get a bunch of answers founded out of a belief you do not accept, which gets no one anywhere.
You don't have to accept the theist's idea of God, but you do have to accept it as what theist's believe, and actually know what you're talking about when representing it in a debate, so that your argument is intelligible. A theist doesn't have to expend much effort thinking about your question, because it is as you say, "theist think God solves the problem". There isn't anything to think about because the theist idea of God accepts that everything "begins and ends" with God, by default.
I understand that might not be you're faith or understanding of 'Divinity', or that you can't see how anyone could think that is possible, because I see that you don't see God in the same light as I do, whereas you do not. You assume my idea of God is to be taken in the same light as yours. I am not talking "apples and oranges", here, but more like "apples and corn". Your question doesn't make sense to the theist's idea, and the theist's idea doesn't make sense to you, because you're trying to measure "weight" in "feet and inches".
The theist's idea of God accepts Divinity as 'Infinite in Being', yet you impose finite limitations upon the theist's idea, which does not apply. "If humans came from monkeys, then why...yada, yada, yada?" The question doesn''t matter or begin to challenge what evolution 'is'. If God is infinite, how can finite limitations apply? The theist's idea of God does not in any way imply that "God has origins". That is a projection of you're limited understanding of Divinity, and failure to understand the definition of, 'infinite'.
Both science and religion agree that the infinite and nonlinear, always result in and effect the finite and linear, just as the 'emptiness' of the sky allows clouds to pass freely. 'Silence and stillness' are the ever-present background that makes "sound and motion" detectable. It is out of 'intangible and formless' thought that ideas arise as "tangible form". The physical world has been discovered to be made entirely of nonphysical subatomic particle charges, that never physically interact with one another.
'To exist', fundamentally is a nonlinear expression. If energy and matter cannot be created or destroyed, only made to change form, it would suggest that existence is 'eternal' and 'uncaused', and not unlike an 'Omnipresent God', without "beginning and end". Something, indeed, cannot come from 'no-thing', which is why there is only ever 'something'. The whole concept of theism is rooted in the idea that, God is the 'Ineffable', and explains, that 'something', that cannot be fully be put into the limitations of human understanding.
The opening passages of the Book of Genesis do not explain the "beginning of existence", as God's Presence signifies that existence 'already exists'. What Genesis is describing is the 'origins of form', in which the Bible says God made the "heavens and earth" from the 'formlessness' of "darkness and void", before saying, "Let there be light". God is the 'Uncaused Source' of all existence. To ask, "what came before God?", is like asking, "what is wetter than water?". There cannot be anything that comes "before" or "after", 'Always' and 'Forever'.
Something definitely happened about 13.7 billion years ago. It inflated very rapidly for a fraction of a second. Particles were created from a cooling trillion degree plasma.
I think all of us would like to know more. Even the people who 'know' the answer already, (Christian creationists).
Like how myopic and vacuous....no matter what the final theory, multiverse or not, the answer is still god made it so. Sad, raising kids like that.
Your non logic fails you, as atheistic thinking always does.
The Creator of the universe can not be constrained within said universe, as it didn't exist until He Created it.
Logically, He existed outside of existence when He Created existence.
God also requires no Creator as He is defined as eternal, omniscient, omnipresent, and almighty. An eternal entity can not have a beginning. It violates the dictionaries definition of "eternal".
I recommend all atheists return to 3rd grade and seek their GED, but outside of the failed tax funded public school systems of America.
If Romans 11:33-36 does not satisfy matters of "existence" or "nothingness", then all you have left is philosophy, psychology, good advice, etc., which are man-made concepts.