I believe the main flash point between MRA's and feminists is the the issue of rape?

I believe that we should remove gender from domestic violence issues.

I think you are burying your head in the sand when it comes to rape and sexual assault. And yes, I believe that one in two women will be assaulted in her life. The degree differs from woman to woman. I believe that men are also victims of sexual assault. And perhaps far more than we acknowledge.

I do not believe, as you have commented to me, that all men are animals or rapists. I believe that some men or women think that they are not offensive and refuse to acknowledge the distress they cause. I do think that we have too many rape apologists here.

I think that it is not only feminists who are unreasonable. I think that there are too many people who refuse to believe that children are physically assaulted (as my sons were, as I was, as my daughter in law was - etc etc).

I think that the most damage to men as a gender is caused, not by feminists, but by those who behave sexually inappropriately.

No matter what figures you put out - someone will not agree:-

HOWEVER - 2008 figures on REPORTED rape in the United States from the FBI stated that there were 89,000 rapes of both men and women. Allowing that most were of women - and even allowing that NONE of these was a multiple rape (hardly a realistic position) such as a house-held situation etc which could be literally hundreds of times....

Those figures translated into a need for any woman living at that time in the United States to live to be 324 years old in order to run the risk of being raped at 1 in 4.

The official figure for rape is 5 in10,000 women annually - a VERY small number.

Therefore, there are a miniscule number of rapists out there and feminist rhetoric about it is just lies, and needs to be dropped forthwith. Its only purpose was, is and will be to disempower men by forcing them to be held to totally unrealistic and frankly insane requirements in their daily lives - AND to suffer unwarranted and illegal sanctions as currently apply in 'domestic violence'.

As for the rape apologist apologists - nothing I said there condones or supports rape EVER - nor do the vast majority of men. Get over your idiocies.

As for the 'education gap' - how many times must it be made clear that the education system was violated to suit girls more in 1986 here in Astralia - as a purely feminist agenda appraoch. It is currently being ripped apart by the demand from government here for a minimum of three examinations that will give a more acurate picture of RETAINED KNOWLEDGE instead of 'coursework' - a requirement that is already getting negative whining from the ultra-feminised 'teacher's federation' on the basis that it is causing stress and tears for students - guess which students - not the boys!

Your point about men being driven out of teaching is just - I read - in 1997, an article in New Zealand which cited three cases of men teachers being hounded out with false accusations - one losing his home etc, through costs, even though vindicated. He was never compensated and resigned rather than face more.

THIS MUST BE STOPPED FORTHWITH.

As the Platypus said - there are other issues they rave on about - none of which are in the hands of anyone in the streets... and only a couple of which have much merit at all anyway.

NOBODY is entitled to free childcare... nobody is entitled to to be force-fed into an elected position or an appointed position that holds huge responsibility for ALL EQUALLY and not one 'side' of the gender (or other) debate

The rest that he mentions - well - let's just say they are ALL personal choices and have no place in any insane jihad.

Domestic violence is another skewed ideological stance and not a genuinely approached issue, and is a platform for violence and disempowerment against men in the exact same mold as 'rape', and is THE major point of attack on legal and human rights here in Australia, which is why I oppose these 'LAWS' in their entirety.

Again for the benighted and utterly moronic - that statement does NOT condone or support genuine violence ever - other than the direct violence of government itself against rights and the Law, and those acts of direct violence that ensue from that violence.

Nah, I don't think this is the main problem. A certain type of feminist goes on about rape a lot because it's sensationalist and gets attention, but it isn't the main concern of most feminists. Those are:

*ABORTION (and you're on the same page with them about that, although a lot of MRAs aren't);

* Single motherhood (wonderful thing, government/fathers should give them more money, everyone should celebrate and validate their amazing heroic efforts etc)

*Daycare (should be more of it, more state subsidies, more flexible employers);

* Female representation in high-profile positions (why aren't there more women politicians / judges etc);

*Sexism (broad term to encompass any behaviour they don't like or any decision not in their favour).

Rape is actually quite low down the list. Even if rape was eradicated from the world tomorrow, I don't think it would make an iota of difference to the feminist movement, and they would be making as much of a racket as ever about the above mentioned issues.

Figures like 1 in 2 seem a bit drastic. In fact, I don't like figures at all. Simply put, whether those numbers are right or exaggerated, it is still a known and accepted fact that most rapists tend to be male. It is much easier to do so, and this can be explained through simple biology between the sexes.

You are right domestic violence has nothing to do with this because it can be perpetrated by anyone. And you know what? It goes unreported most of the times with men making it equal.

I guess this could cause a problem with men getting jobs where females are involved, but it is not the fault of anyone specifically, it is the fault of statistics. Boys aren't flunking out of school because of "feminism", there could just be a lack of interest.

I can't speak for the world, but most of the males that I knew in school were more interested in the "easy" way. Such as working in trades or service work instead of teaching.

Well, you're using the batshitcrazy definition of "feminist" and the reasonable definition of "MRAs".

There are some people who identify as feminist who strive for equal rights, and there are others that want female supremacy (the batshitcrazy ones). There are some reasonable MRAs who point out inequalities against men, and then there are the batshitcrazy ones who use the title of MRA to make their sexism justified (just as, I'm sure, some feminists do).

1 in 6 women have been sexually assaulted, not necessarily raped. Sexual assault encompasses rape, but it is much more broad than that - it could have been as simple as a grope. I don't think there is actually a valid rape statistic anywhere on the internet.

as a man who has no father issues or has ever been taken advantage by a man or mistreated. i can say unbiasedly that men are vial creatures that deserve any hate they can get. i am not a feminists and i base all my reasoning on simple logic and by examining the course of human history (which i majored in) testosterone makes us greedy selfish and stubborn. put us all in the same room and that's how you get war and violence. in total i hate humans in general, but i hate men more.

Please provide credible evidence to support your claims.. Either in the form of web links or from credible and influential members of society.

EDIT: I need more substantial evidence to see that any of your claims have any real merit. You seem to be exaggerating here when you state "Men are SCARED to enter primary school teaching - with only 10% of primary school teachers being men. Men are not fond of secondary school education either - any one can make an accusation against a male teacher - and chances are thats all that would be required to end his career."

There is no evidence to prove this claim you have made. You posted a daily mail link that is associated with the male shortage of teachers in the school. That link and article said absolutely nothing about men being scared. You are fabricating information. Also did it occur to to that men maybe simply have no interest in teaching as women do? There are also more women in society today than there are men. Also men want to be the breadwinners of their families, it's not a surprise that teachers don't make a lot of money. I would think men today are getting into more reputable professions like medicine, engineering, or starting up their own companies.

You have yet to prove any of your claims because so far you haven't proven anything. And now it seems you are grasping at straws. What exactly does men sitting on planes and where they sit have anything to do with what you've posted? Out of curiosity. Did you so any real research before posting this?

The almost all men are rapists and all women are raped myth is popular state sponsored propaganda.

Yes, sexism hurts us all. Feminism devolved into misandry. Misandry And Misogyny Are Wrong Because They Are Both Hatred “Like an unchecked cancer, hate corrodes the personality and eats away its vital unity. Hate destroys a man's sense of values and his objectivity. It causes him to describe the beautiful as ugly and the ugly as beautiful, and to confuse the true with the false and the false with the true.” Martin Luther King Jr.(MLKJ)

Misogyny is the hatred or dislike of women or girls. Misandry is the hatred or dislike of men or boys.

Information on misogyny is widely available but often of little value due to its widespread adoption as propaganda to promote hatred. The inappropriateness of misandry is every bit as unacceptable up as the inappropriateness of misogyny. As MLKJ said, both values and objectivity are destroyed by hate. This makes societies vulnerable to manipulation through propaganda.

“If you repeat a lie often enough, it becomes the truth. ” Joseph Goebbels.

These are commonly repeated statements made by misandrists that reflect their values and objectivity, or lack thereof. Such statements are clearly designed to incite hatred:

"All sex, even consensual sex between a married couple, is an act of violence perpetrated against a woman." -- Catherine MacKinnon

"The proportion of men must be reduced to and maintained at approximately 10% of the human race." -- Sally Miller Gearhart

"Men who are unjustly accused of rape can sometimes gain from the experience." Catherine Comins

"I want to see a man beaten to a bloody pulp with a high-heel shoved in his mouth, like an apple in the mouth of a pig." -- Andrea Dworkin

These statements constitute hate crimes. Sections 318 and 319 are the relevant sections of the Canadian Criminal Code. The Criminal Code of Canada says a hate crime is committed to intimidate, harm or terrify not only a person, but an entire group of people to which the victim belongs. The victims are targeted for who they are, not because of anything they have done. A hate crime is one in which hate is the motive and can involve intimidation, harassment, physical force or threat of physical force against a person, a group or a property. In Canada it is also a crime to incite hatred. Propaganda, like the misandrists statements above, is information of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote or publicize a particular political cause or point of view.

Propaganda leads to brainwashing which is to make people foolishly believe something that is not true, Urban Dictionary. Also defined as a forcible indoctrination to induce someone to give up basic political, social, or religious beliefs and attitudes and to accept contrasting regimented ideas.

The riot at Warren Farrell's presentation on helping boy's issues in Toronto in November 2012 is forcible indoctrination to intimidate non-misandrists to adopt misandry which is hate mongering. The authorities such as the university, governments, criminal justice system, etc., all condoned and enabled the misandry behavior by ensuring that their terrorist acts go consequence free. Many of the groups rioting, as identified by their proudly displayed placards, are rewarded by Canadian government agencies for such behavior with funding.

The misandrist's attempts at eliminating free speech through intimidation and violence at the presentation on much needed solutions to boy's issues is a key component of Canada's social control programs. Social control refers to techniques and strategies for preventing human behavior that deviates from government mandated behavior. This behavior enforces Canada's social norms. Members of Canadian society are expected to act properly within the context of Canadian society’s social norms (misandry) which in turn establishes the misandrist's sadistic hate mongering moral and ethical standards by which Canadians now live.

“State propaganda, when supported by the educated classes and when no deviation is permitted from it, can have a big effect. It was a lesson learned by Hitler and many others, and it has been pursued to this day.” Noam Chomsky, Media Control: The Spectacular Achievements of Propaganda

In Canada, misandry is a massive state sponsored hate mongering industry as was proven at the riot and in subsequent non-responses by the Canadian government. The latter condoned the terrorist behavior and continues to fund the rioters involved.

In Canada, any attempt to alleviate the pain and suffering of children is a risky and dangerous proposition if those children are males and targeted by hate mongering misandrists. Live long and Prosper:)

it is unfortunate that i MUST agree.

the 'creep' of the definition of rape to include "bad decisions'' is my largest problem with any feminist on this site... the only proof i can provide is that once the "highest ranked" feminist UN-contacted me only because of a disagreement about me letting drunk wenches 'pick me up' and having a night of wild (AND guilt free) sex. our culture routinely allows alcohol to excuse 'bad behavior'. women learn this and so understand that if they want their physical needs met, they can enjoy drunk sex without feeling like a harlot... because SO many parents raise their girl children to think that only slvts enjoy sex out of wedlock.

the same way many men that have awakened with a "wolftrap" asleep on their arm, so too should women accept the consequences of their actions.

You have absolutely no names or links to support any of this. My problem with the MRM is the fact it exists as an anti feminist "movement". And the fact that most of a voice for men activism recently includes posting personal details of "bigamists" online and basically advocating for the stalking/harrasment of said "bigamists". This is bullying. Also, the MRM represents white. straight dudes primarily. I see no evidence of them advocating for ethnic minorites or gay or trans men.

There is no flashpoint. The MRM is a fringe group who reached its peak in '04. More people google "horse p0rn" or "smelly discharge" than "mens rights". As a feminist, the MRM has little relevance to me.