Alright,let us say you were trying to convert me.I'm a anti-Papal Bible-Alone protestant,How would you witness to me?What would you tell me?Is 4P's-1P better or the seat of Peter better?How do you defend the doctrines that the other one claims is heretic or false?Who seperated from who? Which fallows the fullness of the Apostolic traditions?What discredits the other from being Validly the church?
P.S I am not a protestant,nor a Roman/Eastern "Yet".I still need answers that satisfy me,not by my own wants or will but what is truths of truths.I know one of these two is the truth,but right now I've been feed so much papaganda(?) against both of these,I'm severly confused.I know the history up to 1045,I know more about the Eastern but then again to be perfectly fair I know very little about the Roman Past the Papraganda(?) I was feed by my former cult/domination.
Trevor2009-07-18T01:10:27Z
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We believe the Catholic Church was founded by Jesus. [see: Matthew 16:18-20]
Jesus gives St. Peter the keys to the Kingdom of heaven.
To be honest, for the most part, Catholicism and Orthodoxy have almost identical beliefs, the major differences are mostly cultural. We both believe in the sinlessness of the Virgin Mary, the Real Prescence of Christ in the Eucharist, ect.
If we want to look at it realistically. The Church, wether the Catholics or Orthodox are right, is suppost to be Universal as the Nicean Creed States. However look at Catholicism vs. Orthodoxy.
Orthdoxy hasn't really gone past Eastern Europe, it is dwarfed by Catholicism. With the beliefs between the two Churches being SO similar, neither one can condemn the other as a false Church. The Catholic Church however, not the Orthodox, has stayed faithful to the Vicar of Christ, the Bishop of Rome.
Protestantism on the other had has over 33,000 difference denominations all claiming to have the most accurate interpretation of the Bible, all disagreeing with each other, and not to mention individual members that have their own interpretations as well. Beliefs of the very same denomination will often change with time and popularity. Seventh-Day Adventists use to deny the doctrine of the Trinity, now they accept it. Many Baptists use to forbid alcohol, now some allow it. Most Protestant denominations didn't even celebrate Christmas until the 1930s because it was regarded as a "Catholic holiday".
There is very little difference at all in the two you mentioned ..the eastern has a valid Eucharist and traces back to the Apostles but does not believe in Papal infallibility...The Roman Catholic Church Obviously has the Papal infallibility , The Chair of Peter , the First Pope ..the Apostles Chosen by Jesus to lead the Others..and Choose a Replacement for Judas He went to Rome , Preached in Rome Governed in Rome and Died (Martyred) in Rome. Jesus named him Peter the Rock on Witch he will build his Church ..not Churches.. If you read from the Early Church fathers you will find in Around 70 AD there was a letter written in where one of the disciples of John the Apostle tells his congregation that if they hear anything contrary to what he has shown them they should refer to the Bishop of Rome for Guidance..meaning the Pope...This is from a man taught by John the Apostle ..and Believed to be Ordained by Peter Himself...The Roman catholic Church and the eastern Orthodox Both have ties to the Apostles , it's just that the Roman Catholic Church Doctrine is Protected ..and can not or will not Change, the Authority of the Pope prevents any one man or parrish from changing it or it's interpretation...this can not be said for the others.... They do not believe any one authority was chosen by Jesus...I also understand that in some of the eastern orthodox that Paul had more Authority and that is why Peter was not concidered a Leader.
I'm not sure one can answer you in such short space a proper answer.The first two you got are a example of what we Catholics put up with everyday here on R&S and world governments daily.So my suggestion is to read the writings of the early Church Fathers.As far as between the Orthodox Church and the Catholic Church to put it very bluntly there separation is really over how words were used between the two. Such as the Orthodox became unhappy because in the Nicene Creed said and used by both faiths daily we say the Holy Spirit comes from the Father and the Son where as the Orthodox use the original wording from the Father only. Another difference is They want the Pope to be only first among Equals not absolute head of the Church.Twenty six branches of the the Orthodox Church have returned to union with Rome since the 1054 split.Both Orthodox and Catholic beliefs are very much the same with minor differences. Another Difference between Catholic and Orthodox Churches is Orthodox Churches are mainly nationalistic Churches. Such as Greek Orthodox or Russian Orthodox.Just type the words Early Church Fathers in you search engine and read for your self a favorite of mine is ST.Ignatius a disciple of John the Apostle along with Polycarp and Origiaen.Here is a sample from ST.Ignatius written around 107AD to the Symrnaeans........Chapter 8. Let nothing be done without the bishop See that you all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as you would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is [administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church. It is not lawful without the bishop either to baptize or to celebrate a love-feast; but whatsoever he shall approve of, that is also pleasing to God, so that everything that is done may be secure and valid.
Orthodox and Roman Rite are the two largest branches of Catholicism, but not the only. Just under the Holy See there are over 20 different rites. Perhaps one of those is better suited to your needs?
For instance, if I didn't love being a Franciscan, which requires I be Roman Rite, I'd be a Byzantine. I love their Divine Liturgy.
Biblically speaking, Jesus (and Saint Francis for that matter) said that our very lives must be what converts people.
I have thoroughly enjoyed reading some of the beautiful answers you have gotten from my brother and sister Catholics. The way Catholics attack issues nowadays it is obvious they will never feed us to the lions again.
I feel spiritually bound to say something on this matter. We must remember that EO and RC are now in union with one another. There is no doubt we are children of the same mother Church. The Schism of 1054 separated us over a doctrinal issue and management difference, but we celebrate the same 7 sacraments. This makes them my brothers and sisters in Christ. The Catholic faith recognizes there are Christians outside the church, so greater recognition is due the EO as they are of the Church.
I refuse to discredit what is the belief of my brothers and sisters, as this is not in keeping with the love and tolerance shown to us by Christ. You must follow the Holy Spirit in your choice and which ever you choose know that you are being blessed by the original Church of Jesus Christ and are saved by the grace of God. God be with you.