Mormons, I took Moroni's challenge and the Holy Ghost told me that the Book of Mormon is not true, and...?
...that the LDS church is not right for me.
How come Moroni only keeps his promise to some people?
Old Timer Too: Hmm, let's break it down, shall we?
"4. And when ye shall receive these things..." i.e. read the book; check.
"...I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true..." check.
"...and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart..." check.
"...with real intent..." check.
"...having faith in Christ..." check.
"...he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost." nope, no check. As stated previously, she manifested unto me the truth of opposite.
Clearly, I met all the "requirements" stated in Moroni 10:4. Or was there also some bureaucratic paperwork I forgot to file somewhere?
Yes, I understand who is who. The speaker in this chapter is Moroni (verse 1 beings "Now, I Moroni..."), so Moroni is making the promise, ostensibly on God's behalf; God is supposed to be the keeper of the promise, THROUGH th
the Holy Ghost ("...that ye would ask God...he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.)
However, I phrased it the way I did because the verse in question is commonly referred to as "Moroni's promise." Asking, "How come God only keeps the promises Moroni makes on his behalf to some people?" sounds pretty awkward, don't you agree?
Ok, now that your nitpickiness is hopefully satisfied and it has been established that I can read, my question remains: How come God only keeps the promises Moroni makes on his behalf to some people?
Is it because Moroni is actually speaking specifically to the Lamanites in this passage? Oh yeah, I noticed you did not include "who the promise was being made to" in your list of things I obviously don't know; perhaps you have forgotten or do not know yourself that verse 1 begins, "Now I, Moroni, write somewhat as seemeth me good; and I write unto my brethren, the Lamanites...&q
Lamanites..."
So perhaps I got a different answer because I am not Native American? But the LDS church does not usually stipulate that Moroni's promise applies only to Lamanites; in fact I have never once heard them do so in all my years spent in the midst of Mormons.
So I guess you are just not able to accept the idea that someone could pray as prescribed and still get a different answer than you. You have to resort to questioning my sincerity, though you know absolutely nothing about me or what I've been through in my spiritual journey. Meanwhile, the sincerity of those who get the "right" answer is simply taken as a given. As long as they are in your tribe and confirm your biases, you assume they are beyond suspicion.
This "you either get the right answer or you're doing it wrong" rationale is kind of a "heads I win, tails you lose" thing, isn't it? If you refuse to take seriously the spiritual experiences and personal revelation
revelations of people of other faiths, then that means you have rigged the game so that you can't be wrong, which you wouldn't have to do if you were in fact confident that your beliefs were true.
Clover: Yes, God herself revealed herself to me. Literally and undeniably. And told me your book is fiction. Next question?
Like Old Timer, you are simply unwilling to accept that anyone other than Mormons can hear from God. But you are wrong, and you will never, ever admit it because your faith hinges entirely on the idea that you belong to the special club with the one and only direct line to God.
You are the one who is insincere. You decided from the beginning that there was only one possible answer, and that is the only one you will accept. If someone else gets a different answer, you demand that they do it again and again until they get the answer you want. That isn't sincerity, it's confirmation bias. It's built into the test itself; Moroni's so-called challenge is insincerity at its worst, and you are a hypocrite.
But you did get one thing right: It is between me and God, and she knows what is in my heart. I do not have to swear anything to you.
Ammon: You expect people to follow all the rules of your religion before they decide whether or not to join it? Weird.
Also, I already GOT a Heavenly answer. You are all acting as if I said I prayed and got no answer. That isn't what I said. I got an answer, you just don't like the one I got, so you pretend I didn't do it right. Ridiculous.