What do my fellow Jews think of SUZANNE'S comment that 'G-d allowed the Holocaust because?

It's thoroughly disgusting, that's what I think.

(I'm not Jewish; I hope you don't mind that I put in my 2 cent's worth anyway.)

Thank you, especially in light of the fact that I've probably angered you before with my comments on Zionism - which, by the way, I've decided to take an entirely new look at when I have the time and find some good books :)

Will most certainly do - thanks again for being open-minded and forgiving. You're pretty cool :)

You're asking an excellent question. The fact that you ask this question shows that you understand that everything G-d does is for the best and that He wants us to learn and benefit from everything that happens. There are many reasons why G-d let the holocaust happen. I cannot address all of them, nor am I qualified to discuss this sensitive subject here in this forum, but I will just mention that a steady decline in Jewish observance began in Europe, I believe, in the 1600's already. It picked up speed with the Reform movement in the 1800's, and between the two world wars the decline became very rapid. Fortunately, since the holocaust, an upsurge in Jewish observance has gradually developed and has been picking up speed with every passing year. Norah, the best place for you to address your question and get true answers that would satisfy you, is from an Orthodox rabbi. There are rabbis that specialize in outreach to unaffiliated Jews and this is one of the questions they are expert at addressing. I have listed below some websites where you can present your question and get an answer from a qualified Orthodox rabbi. I wish you much success!

I have heard this before. It is the old "blame the Jews" thing even when Jews were the primary victims. People also forget though Jews were the primary target, Jehovahs Witnesses, gays, communists, gypsys etc were also targeted. Did they refuse to obey God too?

People cannot answer that one.

We do not reject the Messiah. Jesus was not the Messiah. We did not disobey God.

Nazi's commited the holocuast. People. Human beings who didn't even believe in God killed millions of innocent people.

God allows us free will. The Nazi's used it improperly.

I lost family in the holocaust and to blame them for their own demise is beyond revolting. How dare anyone do this!

Blaming the victim is a very old game and in Germany it was played with disasterous consequences. The Nazi's themselves blamed the Jews for their own destruction and the destruction of Nazi Germany. We were responsible for both? That flys in the face of even the slightest logic (which there is none of in either argument).

I don't think that line of thinking is arrogance so much as it is full of hate.

The Jewish world is still feeling the effects of the holocaust and it lives the heart and soul of every Jew who was living at the time, is living now or has yet to be born. It resides within us because it is a lesson that though we can be murdered, systematically and with ruthless effeciency by people who were (and are) obviously evil, and yet we will be blamed for our own torment. It is a lesson every Jew knows and understands.

It is disgusting and nothing can make me angrier than this argument.

Evil people allowed the holocaust. A silent nation of "good people" who stood back and said nothing, allowed the holocaust. A world who didn't want to get involved while the Einsatsgruppen were using infants for target practice and old men were bring burned in ovens, allowed the holocuast.

The victims did not allow it. Make no mistake. Those who perpetrated it and those who ignored it are the villans. Not the Jews.

Note:Sorry about the rambling and the spelling errors but I get very angry about arguments like this girl said. It is so very ignorant to use the Torah to explain the Holocaust and not only ignorant but hateful. Very very hateful.

I am not Jewish but I would like to comment. The thing that frightens me is I am not surprised by the comment. There some (not all) Christians who while preaching about a Prince of peace are actual filled with this kind of evil. They do not even recognise what they are saying is wrong and hurtful. Why they have such a warped view of things I am uncertain.

What SUZANNE has said goes beyond antisemitism. With your average racist they at least know that they are hating. While these type of people are so misguided that they think they are speaking the truth. They not only disregard everything outside the bible as the work of the devil, they also twist the bible to justify there insanities. While I do not attack Christianity or any religion, there are some fundamentalist sects that need serious help. Why people like this, are not sectioned and given psychiatric help worries me.

It raise the question are they indoctrinated into this thinking or are they recruited because of there mental malfunctions ?

I am sorry that you have been subjected to such hurtful views. Hopefully you will not be marred by this and continue to faith in human nature.

I'd cry if I didn't laugh.

As a third generation atheist who has searched high and low for the invisible man in the sky the two 'faiths' I find hardest to deal with are xians (which of course includes messianic 'jews') and muzlims.

Christians like Bishops Spong and Tutu are Walking the Walk.

Fun-dies like Nasty Suzanne can't even talk the talk without coming across as a sadistic imbecile.

As an aside my mother was in Ravensbrück for 2.5 years, till the end of WW2, for helping Jewish children to safety ... outa Nazi clutches.

I could imagine Nasty Suzanne siding with the Nazis cos the Jews didn't accept her limited world view (and therefore needed to be punished) … a view shared with most Roman Catholics of the time … starting with the pope.

Nasty Suzanne has helped me understand how 'ordinary Germans' let this happen ... she has served a purpose in a perverse way.

Thank you Nasty Suzanne.

~

I never made an “agnostics only” or “capitalists only” post, so can I answer???

I think people always have and always will think, say, and do ignorant and uncivilized things. I am personally against people making a big noise every time some says something stupid. Nevertheless, statements like this give and excuse to the dumber half of the population to do dumb stuff.

I think you should start (and for a change I am being serious) a petition to make this lady apologize.

Well, I'm not Jewish (not christian-y either) so I hope you don't mind I answer your question.

The whole Holocaust remark totally pisses me off. I wonder why Christians seem to believe in this angry, vengeful God. It seems that whenever something awful happens they automatically blame the victim, claiming that they must have done something to piss God off instead of blaming those who committed the crimes on their own free will. ***shakes head*** Sometimes I think it would be funny that when the world ends the Christians find out that the Jews, the people they persecuted for centuries and waged genocide, were right after all.

Welcome to the land of the blind and ignorant - people like that aren't even worth the time of day.

Except of course, that people like that will ALSO use this excuse to either participate in, or look the other way, if Jews start being put into the ovens again.

It's the nature of their soul - they are Amalek. Don't expect anything different from them. In a way it's better to see these types out in the open where they can be faced. We know where they are, they know where we are. These kind don't bother me - they aren't going to change their ignorance so I just don't bother with them, I leave them alone like the animals they are.

It's the ones who always say how much they just LOVE the Jews, and will turn around and try to evangelise us and bring us into their idolatry, thus murdering our souls, that really bother me. They are the sneaky ones. Then there's the Messianic "Jews" who, as we all know, are actually 99.9% fundamentalist Christian GENTILES who pretend to be Jews in order to further their own status in the eyes of other non-Jews and to trick Jews into converting to their idolatry.

So of the deceiving type Christians and the right-out-there-in- the-open type with their hatred of Jews - and both types DO hate Jews - I prefer the ones like Suzanne who is right there in front of God and everyone openly with her hatred. She is dealt with much faster and easier than those who sneak and hide behind "loving" words. It doesn't make her type any less despicable than the other type, however.

Your link leads you to a website that is non-existent, however, if she said this, she needs to reported. Don't harass her, but if she says something similar in another post that you are answering a question, hit the report it button. This could be used for insulting other members, hate speech or rant, anything against Yahoo Terms of Service, or anything that is illegal. However, if she posts something that you disagree with but doesn't fall into any of the above, argue with her in compliance to the guidelines. You can comment to people as long as you don't insult or harass them.

Edit: Just something I thought about when reading other posts, do you know your local ADL ofice. If not, go to the ADL website at http://www.adl.org./ I understand your not American, so this might be tricky as this is the American website.

I bet if you were to ask she would say she is a "true christian".

I'm not jewish or christian but I have to say ignorance to that magnitude should be feared by everyone. People like her are responsible for the holocaust in the first damn place.

I know of a high profile "true christian" who suggested that the horror on 9/11 was a punishment for homosexuality. We all know him. He's a well known televangelist and super dumb like the person who suggested the holocaust was punishment for denying jesus as messiah.

The Holocaust has nothing to to with religion or the word of some fictitious God or anything of that sort. It happened because an evil man gained power and popularity by blaming his countrys ills on the jews. then he was able to direct his army and security forces to kill them in the most efficient ways they could dream up. it was an entirely human act. It still happens today and has happened many times since World War Two. God doesnt come into it. at all. period. The sooner we bin all this religion crap and start taking responsibility for our actions is the day the human race finally wakes the f*ck up. P.S Im not Jewish but I am human, will that suffice??