Classical Music Lovers and Arrogance?

You must have seen the many regular postings of one of our classical categories "Top Contributors" who is infamous for answering, "Not classical," and who then proceeds to bash the taste and intelligence of the person asking the question. Nice, huh? There are a few others, "You love Yiruma and you have Horrible Taste in Music."

Some other contributors on Y/A are in earnest about 'cleaning that up.' By way of reporting the misbehavior as an infraction of Y/A rules (rudeness, not actually answering a question, well, you can look them up - all violations of the Y/A code and conditions of use.)

Thank goodness I've spied no professional performer or composer within that negative group. But there are those amateurs and avid fans of classical who, I think, have allowed themselves to think of classical music as THEIRS, i.e. that they own it.

It takes no explanation to see how utterly illogical, false, wrong and silly that perception is. Nonetheless, these are the ones who bark consistently like small dogs chained to a leash, "Hey, this is MY YARD. Stay Away or I'll Bite!."

So very welcoming. So helpful, such a, if you will, "Contribution." It is fairly certain one of those TC's has earned half or more of the total points which awarded that silly orange badge to them by repeatedly saying, for thousands of times, "Not classical / Wrong Category" or "What has this got to do with classical music," etc.

Others are better, but will less often make the occasional slip into like temperament, "There are Standards. I Will Not Lower My Standards," while simultaneously sort of beating up some teenager or neophyte about their taste. As far as the criteria of standards and that sort of behaviour, well, ironic as all hell, is what I say. Some of this second sort are otherwise good folk, with whom I sympathize about the umpteenth question submitted in classical about Bella's Lullaby, sheet music / tab's / note names, etc.

There are criteria for what is good, or bad. But I do agree with you wholeheartedly that there are ways of addressing these differences, in the context of this Y/A format, which exclude rudeness, pathetic shows of power-playing, etc.

When i've responded in kind when the Q is about the New age stuff, I've always suggested something 'legitimately' classical, and 'several cuts up '. They asker will or won't be attracted to the 'higher end' music I've recommended, and if they are they will find out for themselves that what they used to like (past tense) was not of much interest or 'value.'

I have to remind you, and any other readers, that the smarmy "Moral Imperative" attitude of being both owner and custodian of music is pervasive in all other fan-bases of all other genres, too. It is almost always the fans, and not the creators / performers, who go so balistically and maniacally proprietorial.over "Their" music. The classical music fan base does not have a contract of exclusivity of extreme snobbery or bad manners.

A lot of those rude 'owners' of the musics are, I think, very much lacking something in their lives, or are embittered, and it shows up on Y/A in this form. Pity, Pity for them and their condition, a real effin pity they dump their emotional garbage here, and on targets they no longer recognize or remember as people. Remote bombing from a plane at high altitude can wholly desensitize the pilot who pushes the button.

Great question, I thank you for the opportunity to frame some sort of 'answer.'

Best regards.

I have wondered the same thing. How many would answer as derisively IN PERSON? Easy to sling insults through a monitor. If the question is so exasperating, why answer??? If you want to set someone straight on what is and is not classical or correct someone on what is a song and what is a symphony, then do so POLITELY.

When I first started listening to classical music several years ago, I did not know the difference between a symphony and a sonata or a concerto and an overture. I went for months with only the first movement of Beethoven's Violin Concerto. I did not know there was more to it than one movement. I simply have not had an education in classical music. One can certainly receive a harsh education in classical music from many who have had the education, but I have learned that there are a lot of educated idiots on this forum.

Let me just say... I'm in music school earning my doctorate. Most classical musicians are EXTREMELY insecure. Instead of enjoying life and making it better for others they work towards fulfilling their egos. I have met students who teach little kids (babysitting) who can't play anything and when questioned about performance they belittle the other. I've also had others copy repertoire and attempt to play it better to belittle the other. It's awful. However there are a few good eggs who play for enjoyment and spread good energy. But in all sincerity. Most Classical musicians are insecure about themselves and try to fulfill their emptiness by being "better" than others. It's a sad but honest truth. I've seen this at competitions, conservatory, and in social settings. That's why they are the worst to hangout with. I hope to meet other good people that are musicians but it's almost always a power trip.

Since classical music is the basis of music, more technical and organized, people feel they are more in touch with "music" having deeper knowledge of it, being a lot more creative on an instrument they might have and they play classically. They probably consider a lot of other types of music simple, lazy, and uncreative. It's better to be open-minded about things and not so critical/negative but some people just aren't and undermine others because they feel that they are smarter, more creative or what ever it may be. Just ignore these negative people.

OK, you've heard from a lot of people who aren't classical music lovers (or performers), and their responses are pretty much, yeah, you're right, classical music people are arrogant, just ignore them.

I represent the other side, although I hope not the arrogance that you refer to.

Classical music has structure, history, complexity. To understand it, you have to study it. You may not have to study it to appreciate it (although you do notice that there are music appreciation classes, right?) It's that study that differentiates your average classical music 'snob' from your average disco 'snob'.

Unlike politics and garage bands, there are real answers to questions in classical music. For instance, if you play a sequence of tri-tones without anything else to 'soften the blow', it'll sound bad to people, trained or not. Knowing what to do with those notes to make them sound _good_ to people, whether they are trained or not, requires training. Not every approach works, and because humans are not machines, even the approaches that work sometimes don't work other times.

So when you get into classical music, like when you learn the alphabet, you find that there are things you can't just let go with "whatever". (Imagine if someone decided to teach their kids to recite the alphabet with every fifth letter shifted three letters earlier in the sequence. What would you say when you heard that child recite the alphabet? You'd be surprised how much you'd sound like a classical enthusiast!)

If you train to perform classical music, it gets worse. There are things you just can't _do_, and you're expected to learn to teach others not to do them. Sure, you can write 'new' music, and you can try to abandon the foundations (all of the history of 1000 years of music)... but you aren't a classical musician anymore, then. And if you want to be successful, you'd better be some kind of genius, and know what's going to appeal to an audience, or you'll be a very poor artist indeed!

So maybe you could give classical music lovers a break, because, believe me, no one else does.

Oh, and yes, when Mozart heard the music of many of Pachelbel's contemporaries, he spat in the dust and called them buffoons. However, he thought Bach was very very good (and incorporated Bach's favorite musical form, the fugue, into some of his own compositions.) And he thought Handel's Messiah was good enough to get it performed again, after it'd been all but forgotten... but he also felt it proper to add clarinets and change the harmonies, as well! So yeah, even Mozart was a classical, arrogant dweeb. (A lot of the time, if you read his letters!)

I think that at a certain level, all serious music aficionados get snobbish. Hell, the rappers get so snobbish they shoot each other.

Classical music listeners (dare I generalize?) often fit a certain mold. You know, often liberally and highly educated, favor European cars, don a smoking jacket for their after-dinner brandy. I'm kidding...a little. Seriously though, who can explain it? Yes, more of them probably contribute to their local public radio station, That's not to say there isn't an NRA member from Alabama who thinks Karajan conducted Beethoven's work best, and could debate the issue with you.

I knew a girl who firmly believed that punk died with Sid. She seriously thought we were fools for listening to anything American or anything recorded after 1980. We couldn't convince her otherwise, even after X released Los Angeles!!!

edit to add; Jeez Bob, Listen to Yngwie Malmsteen play ANYTHING and tell me why metal-heads shouldn't be snobs.

It is a serious profession and passion that is unrecognized by many today. That is a vague generalization. Why are techies so weird looking or fashion designers such snobs? These are examples of what you just said. We are serious and don't have time for people who are immature like most on yahoo answers.

I think I am probably one of those arrogant answerers. I blame this on my little rule "ask stupid questions, get stupid answers." Its not that I disapprove of anybody elses taste in music, it is simply that they have been ignorant, and that annoys me.

I have dedicated the majority of my life to studying something that IS a form of art - and to have stupid people come in asking questions that belittle the art form and the history and rules behind it is very nearly insulting. For example, I learnt to read music when I was four, and when I see someone come in asking for the "notes, as letters" to a piece of music, I just think "what is wrong with you that you cannot look up how to read basic music?"

I like all types of music, classical, folk, jazz, blues, RnB, and even some hip hop. if the questions asked in the CLASSICAL section were asked in any other section, I wouldnt care - thats more appropriate.

Mozart was incredibly opinionated - he probably DID spit at the ground on hearing Pachebel! Why would you use either of those composers as an example?!

To highlight my own snobbiness - I have a question for you: can you name ten works by BOTH of those composers?

I think it is purely your perception.

It is also about how seriously some people regard their music. People who are classical music enthusiasts often like other forms of music... but they hold classical in the highest regard... and quite commonly aren't keen on other music that doesn't "measure up."

If people would refrain from posting irrelevant questions in the classical music category, you might not even have acquired this perception, on the other hand when they do post questions about some trite rubbish or such, will likely come under fire. Many of the regular contributors tire of questions about "The river flows in you" and are rightly scornful of the accolades it receives from the uninitiated.

However, they don't saunter over to the rap category and tell all the contributors there that their morm of "music" is rubbish (that would be inappropriate) - however if they venture into the classical category...?

sadly, humans love to put each other down.

Rudeness is never nice, yet I think that you may have met only a few mean people who like classical music.

Thus please don't let that image stand for all the people who like classical music. I love classical, but I respect all genres from heavy metal to pop (even though I'd rather not listen to certain pop today..lol)

If you feel insulted by someone who can't understand why you have a different opinion, you should just remember that it's their problem not yours.