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the flawed idea of god, religion and the concept of free will.?
ok bear with me..... i want to get other people's opinions on this. in the bible, it says that the devil cannot offer what he cannot provide, yet when jesus was in the desert, the devil tempted him, and offered to make him master of all he surveyed (aka earth). Yet the devil is only the master of hell, therefore he can't offer to make jesus the lord of Earth, unless Earth is actually hell. Furthermore, the bible says that hell isn't a pit of fire and lake of lava, but is just being completely disconnected from god. Can we see god? can we touch him? can he have an actual conversation with him? if you ask me we are already disconnected from him, (if he exists....)
Furthermore, the laws of physics state, that if you know the location and speed of every single particle in the universe, you can map out where they're going, and what will happen. (just like if you're playing snooker, and you watch the ball moving, you can predict what other balls it will hit, and where they will end up). Even the human brain is just made up of particles colliding and interacting, so if you can determine what the particles in the brain are currently doing, then you know what they will do later. ergo, they are moving on a fixed path which they cannot deviate from. therefore free will is an illusion.
Also, why would god allow so many people to suffer? most christians will claim that god is testing us, yet god is omnipitent, so he knows what the result of the test will be. the purpose of a test is to find out what the result will be. so what is the point in god testing us when he knows what we'll do??? and saying 'you will be rewarded for your suffering in heaven' is not an excuse, because heaven is meant to be perfect bliss. how can people who have suffered more get a greater reward, if everyone is given perfect bliss????
(i know this was a long read, but i've always had problems with this, and wanted some other opinions. btw i was raised christian but now an athiest)
7 Answers
- Ernest SLv 79 years agoFavorite Answer
If you have become an Atheist you have said goodbye to reason and thinking.
Atheists set up their premise and bend everything to agree with that premise, breaking all rules of logic and reality to become simply absurd. It is a device, a mind game in an attempt to hide from sin and accountability.
It is tiresome to play foolish mind games with Atheists.
You even do it in what you have written. Your first statement is false. So is your second.
There is no coherent train of thought in what you have written. It amounts to a rant.
How many questions are you asking and which one do you want answered?
Atheists cannot be pinned down to anything, because if they could they would soon be proved wrong. That is why you are so full of confusion.
You don't want to be pinned down because you don't want to have to confess your sin and the darkness of your life. You refuse the light because it will reprove you and show what you do and how you live to be wrong.
- R J LongLv 59 years ago
Who told you that the devil is the master of hell? Read Matthew 25:41. Hell is where the devil will be imprisoned, not where he will rule. I'm curious. Did you get your idea of hell from the Spawn comic books? On the other hand, the New Testament does call the devil the ruler of this world. Look it up.
Even if we grant that Heisenberg's Uncertainty Prinicple does not apply to God, so that He can know the location and speed of a subatomic particle (which I'm willing to grant), you have missed the fact that these laws of physics apply to situations in which there is no interfering agent to muck things up. To use your example, your laws of physics won't help you at the snooker table if someone keeps reaching in and whacking the balls around. If you reply that knowing all the particles in the room will tell you when and how that jerk is going to affect the balls, then you are turning your conclusion ( there is no free will) into your premise ( I can predict what Dipwad's going to do because it's all just particle movement since there's no free will).
So, what place would there be for you in this perfect world in which people don't suffer? Do you seriously have such a high opinion of yourself that you don't believe that your actions (you will admit that you've done SOME things wrong, won't you?) have caused suffering to others? So please tell me where God is to draw the line, that He won't allow the really big suffering to happen, but He will allow you to mess around with others? I won't even address your notion that some soul in Heaven is going to yell, "No Fair! Why should that guy's bliss be as perfect as mine since I had to suffer more on Earth?"
Good gravy. Surely you could have come up with these replies on your own if you had wanted to.
- ?Lv 49 years ago
Ok 1st paragraph. You're mixing what you've heard with scripture. First of all Satan is not the ruler of hell, he never was and never will be. He's the ruler of hell in south park which is fiction. Hell was created by God. It actually is a place made by God. I'm not exactly sure about all the details, but eventually hell will be no more and all that are in it. Satan will be thrown into hell sometime in the confusing and not fully understood end times. Some people say they believe hell to be the complete separation of God, which is not true. There are descriptions like where there's "weeping and gnashing of teeth". But Jesus is constantly clear that there is a dumpster where things go to burn.
Second paragraph you said free will is an illusion based on the human brain and how everything is based on a track. You're starting to turn into a Calvinist and not an Atheist. Meaning you think there is no free will and everything is meant for a reason? Maybe I'm not fully grasping your point here.
Third paragraph. The problem with suffering is that it builds character and further develops us. It causes us to trust more and to see reality much easier. We build this undefinable word called "Faith" which can't be explained or described very easily. We can't grow faith by what we see, hear, feel or touch. Many had seen Jesus perform miracles but had hard hearts toward him and constantly tried to explain it in their minds. God knows that man can't be convinced, but he can be taught. People don't suffer because of what God does. God doesn't cause people to suffer. He has a tolerance level when people go to far. When Adam and Eve opened up the world to the knowledge of good and evil we carry the weight of that knowledge. There are greedy people out there that hold all the money, there are angry people out there that hold lots of hate. This is what God allows when they take advantage of each other. When God gave the mark of the beast the numbers 666, he first says that it's the same number as man. Man is what causes suffering and pain. God actually keeps his hand and heals what he can in a messed up world. He allows injustice and evil to happen, but his tolerance has a limit.
- Anonymous9 years ago
We were created to do the will of God. No man can image God unless they live by God's will instead of their own. That is why Jesus could say the following: Matthew 4:4 Â "But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God."
Your will cannot be free to use as you please if God can afterward punish you for it. Some argue that you only have the right to choose to obey or disobey God and that also is shallow thinking. God would not destroy you for it if he had given you the right.
Let's face it free-will is self-will and it only alienates us from God and His spirit.
One day the false doctrine of free-will will be defeated as it causes much bad. We have our only real freedom in Christ where God's love is not cramped when we live to do the will of God.
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- ?Lv 69 years ago
Well to Christians Satan rules the earth and God rules heaven. But yeah everything else you wrote pretty much disproves their religion.
- IRX120ISBEASTLv 49 years ago
Well if god didn't provide that test the results would not exist
You need Jesus
You are a sinner
I am a sinner we both need Jesus we cannot save ourselves
- Anonymous9 years ago
Hey I guess you haven't figure out the premise here
you ask a question and we answer it
You aren't really all that smart are you?