If we lost in Iraq, who won? How did we?

No one has won or lost. The way America can truly win is to keep fighting terrorism and not amongst ourselves. The battle could already be over, but Americans do not have to resolve nor the balls to do what is necessary to eliminate the threat. The words are nothing more than talking points, rhetoric and political lingo that makes it appear that something is actively being done. Unfortunately we don't have the media to cover what is really happening over there and the republicans have taken a vow of silence and wont stand up for what is being done. The only ones losing is the politicians. Don't let yourself continue to be brain washed by liberal media, self righteous politicians and other agenda driven people. Ask the majority of soldiers, sailors, airmen, and marines. I am sure you will find some that just want to some home and watch TV, but the majority are there for a purpose that is seen far clearer through their eyes versus our TVs, Semper Fi

A loss on our part does not necessarily mean that a specific faction or group won.

I would say it is loss on nearly on all sides.

The main problem that is revealed by your question is that the objectives were never clarified. No one asked what a 'win' would look like. Was it for WMD? Which was switched when those didn't materialize to a mission of democracy building- so is that the true mission?

These questions were asked by very few in 2003 and answered by even fewer.

One might play devil's advocate and say that because there was no clear objectives to claim a win that one cannot claim it is a loss. This argument would deny the reality of the situation, thousands of Americans dead, hundreds of thousands of Iraqis dead and a collapsing non functional government. One could only call that situation a 'win' if the current situation was the explicit, insane goal.

People are forgetting the difference between power and importance. Take Vietnam. The US was clearly more powerful militarily yet it was defeated, why? I think a signifcant reason is that the Vietnamese were fighting for their land, it was a life or death struggle for them that had very strong, lasting implications for their country. To the US the war in Vietnam was a fight for ideology - to fight for ideology is really a luxury. Note how the US is not extremely different even after the defeat whereas Vietnam's fate depended on the outcome.

For these reasons:

-the US is not very good at dense, urban fighting among civilian populations

-the US (nor is any country) good at fighting in a place that its own populus doesn't see as important or essential

-that nobody, especially countries with histories of colonization, likes to be invaded - especially by westerners

I think it was doomed, and we lost before the first boots hit the ground or the first bombs dropped.

From 2003 to late 2006 the Repubicans have had both houses- that makes up the majority of the war- so how did the Democrats lose it? The perception that we are and have been losing, and that Bush is doing a poor job goes back to late 2004 and 2005- well before the Nov 06 backlash that put the Democrats in power.

The only ones who truly 'won' would be those that made money on it, blood stained money if you ask me.

The Bush Junta 'won' the war. They screwed up the occupation. Instead of everything settling down to the point where the Iraqis were ready open a Wal-Mart and a Starbucks on every corner they rejected the 'Vichy Iraq' puppet government. Basically these folks are waiting for US troops to go home so they can start slaughtering each other until one group or the other comes out on top. Had cooler heads prevailed we wouldn't be in this fix. If you remember at the time anyone who spoke out against this war was called a surrender monkey or an 'appeaser' or a Saddam lover. Now, five years later, and who knows how many lives and limbs, how much borrowed money and the cost of all the rest of it, we're in an economic death spiral as the world goes on without us. We're no 'safer', no problems have been solved and there's no bottom that anyone can point to. On the plus side the crazies of the GOP have more or less killed themselves off.....who knows... there may be another Eisenhower out there. Let us pray!

Nobody won...

How did we lose? We went there ill prepared or equipped to deal with the aftermath of collapsing Saddam and his regime.

The collapse of the Saddam regime and the dismissal of the army left the field wide open for major trouble - trouble that we were and are not equipped to handle effectively, even if we go "on the offensive" or suddenly become "proactive". It's too late for that at this stage.

We should honestly and openly mourn all those who have died as a result of this misguided and mishandled invasion and occupation. And we should bring our troops out of there for so that no more need die. Bush's idea of imposing democracy in a vacuum just is not workable in Iraq nor anywhere else!

Bush created a mess. Then he expected the Iraqis and the rest of the world to pay for cleaning it up. Things don't work that way.

You are confused the war was won when we drove out Saddam and the old Iraqi army just like when we drove out Hitler and the old Nazi army. Then the occupation began the only difference is when the occupation began in Germany we set up bases to keep an eye on them and we went home for the most part only Bush and corporations want to make Iraq the perfect little conservative country with flat taxes and outlawed labor unions which will keep the Iraqi middle class from returning from Jordan the other problem is that there are tribes that hated each other before Saddam and not they are back to there old ways, the dictator kept them in fear from fighting each other.

Our war in Iraq is an insurgency. Throughout history no one has ever won an insurgency. Our Soldiers who have died have not died in vain they died doing a service for their Country. And that is something we can never forget regardless of the outcome in Iraq.

The Democrats want us to lose in Iraq to undermind George W. Bush. We have never lost a single battle, or anything to that degree, the casuality number is 3000+American soldiers to 58,000 of Vietnam. But because George W. Bush is a Republican, god forbid should he receive ANY praise. We enjoy a wonderful way of life, but because it is run by Republicans we are led to believe we are greedy and living under decadence. What is sad is the degenerate peace movement is justifying an anger inside many Americans that could easily manifest itself into something trully evil. The badness of our country is falling to deaf ears now, and more and more people are going to ignore it. I think more and more people will look back and see that it is the Hippies who are the new "Southern white" that is backward and not educated.

How can you win or lose when it's an invasion and not a war? Wars begin when a country does something to provoke another country. Then the provoked country declares war. None of this has happened. We just invaded a sovereign country for suspicions. You can't do that!!! And as it turns out the suspicions were either faulty or manufactured. How can you win or lose that??

Some tools need to be sacrificed, the army is a tool and tools need to be retired, and used. This is because they are simply an instrument of war and nothing more. We bliss these tools sent over high seas and fight the war, 1/2 way around the world, simply because the Iraqis refused to fight the war. Our young soldiers, will die, they are nothing more than tools of war.

But what about the people who will die tomorrow? I'm sure the dead soldiers wouldn't mind if we corrected a mistake to save future lives from meeting the same fate as them.