Is infanticide better than adoption? Why don't safe abandonment stations work?

I think it's a great idea for the signs... do the mothers REALLY never get asked anything? or offered help? or be followed out?

I know it sounds horrible/terrible, but if they didn't have to see or talk to anyone it would be better- like a (and again, I hate to say something like this) but a safe drop-box at a private location where there are doctors on the other side to give immediate attention to the baby. someplace with no cameras, etc. I don't like it- but it's better than killing the baby.

I think here in Ontario, the good adoption agency is the Children's Aid Society. They adopt out children who are in foster care. We don't have agencies in the traditional sense in great amounts. I don't think I would ever have been comfortable going to an agency, but if we had here is what I would have looked for: 1. Most important (for me) is no religious affiliation. I don't want to be part of an anti-choice agency. 2. Training ingrained before you can become parents. This is not "how to be a parent" but training to better address the specific needs that come out of adoption. (grief, loss etc.) In Ontario we use PRIDE training. 3. OPen adoptions only I guess there could be more, but in reality these are what matter most to me.

Was the baby born alive, or stillborn?

Was she even aware she was pregnant before this baby suddenly appeared? It has been known to happen; could you imagine not realizing you're pregnant and then suddenly...out pops a baby??

You just don't know the circumstances that could lead to a woman doing such a thing. I'm not condoning it either, but you can't just sit there and say she did this with absolutely no feeling or remorse. People just don't DO this without some great, underlying reasons going on beneath the surface.

I agree with the premise behind the "Baby Moses" laws but as it's been already stated, the babies being dropped off at these stations aren't the babies that would otherwise be dropped in a garbage can or left in a cardboard box in the street. They are well cared for.

And with no questions asked, how DO we know who is taking these babies and dropping them off? Can we say, legalized kidnapping? Doesn't anyone realize the implications of this? Grandma or Daddy doesn't want that kid and when new mommy is dozing, bye-bye baby. Mother has NO recourse.

It's scary.

And what about the mother? Is she ok? Does she need medical attention? She could be somewhere hemorrhaging for christ's sake...

We NEED to start asking questions, making sure we KNOW who's dropping off these babies, we KNOW the mother is at least medically ok, mentally stable and SURE of this baby being dropped off, and you know, in the interest of the child, this legalized abandonment is NOT OK.

Medical history? Heritage and identity? Goodbye to EVERYTHING adoptees have been fighting and clawing for. But hey, that's ok...just be grateful he wasn't tossed in a dumpster, right? Pffffft.

I don't think infanticide is better, and I don't see it as a logical option.

That girl will probably have an easy time entering an insanity defense. Pregnant women have hormones running through them that can (apparently) cause them to make somewhat irrational decisions. I am not condoning this act.

I suspect that, now that the hormones have probably subsided, she is feeling the full force of this act. I would not wish that pain on anyone!

I have read of four "safe haven" style abandonments in the past few months. In every single story, the person who dropped off the baby was either too old or the wrong ethnicity to be the mother, or even admitted outright that they weren't the mother.

I hope no one here has a nasty MIL or babysitter who might think this would be a great way to get rid of a crying baby, no questions asked.

That sounds horrible. I am not sure what can be done when a young mother is so scared as they don't think rationally. It would be good to put something in place but as to what is still to be thought of. Hope you have luck thinking up something. Good luck :)

Statistics in California, taken from 54 of the 58 California County Coroners' offices, showed no change in the number of babies found abandoned dead 5 years before and 5 years after the safe haven laws went into affect. These numbers aren't changing.

The few children who are left in the safe haven receptacles are usually found well cared for, properly clothed, blanketed with toys and notes. These are not babies whose mothers would have otherwise dumped them in the trash. The only thing this has managed to do is allow them to circumvent normal adoption planning.

This sad case in Houston shows the issue as it is. There has been and continues to be a very small number of women who commit infanticide soon after birth. What makes anyone think that these women would actually take the child to a safe haven? Indeed, the woman in Houston was practically at the safe haven when she put the child in the garbage.

Although not many women discard there babies after birth, there are issues far beyond not wanting to parent involved in situations where women throw their babies in the garbage.

Anyway, here's a link to the collected stats for California. Letters were sent to each County Coroner's office. The numbers are what were sent back. Of the 58 counties in California, 54 responded.

http://lauriejeans.com/AB81/CalOpenDataTables06270...

ETA:

Joslin is correct about that particular sub-group. These are the women about whom I was speaking when I said there are other issues far beyond just not wanting to parent.

California does advertise it's safe havens, but for the very reasons outlined, we have the results we have.

I think Jenn is on the right track. There are exceptions to every rule. Perhaps more advertising would be better, but I'd be willing to bet that no matter how much the word gets out there, there will still be people who miss it, forget, or just aren't thinking rationally. People mess up, sometimes REALLY badly. I bet no one is hurting more than she is right now, thinking back on what she did.

These are a sub group of pregnant women and girls who deny the pregnancy to themselves, are completely detached from the pregnancy, and will do anything to prevent the acknowledgment of the pregnancy/baby. Therefore, it is not logical to try and make sense of this or even prevent it with a poster. It has to start way way back when this woman/girl was little.....She has no feeling of self esteem, no individualized sense of self, and no ego strength. She is already living a lie, so why wouldn't this make sense to her? Her feelings are shunted. She may not be the mean violent person you think she is. She is often the girl next door, the woman down the street who is just good at blocking off or compartmentalizing her life in order to keep going. When we start teaching young girls about how to be independent and strong and worthy all by themselves, then women won't deny a pregnancy just to maintain status quo with a new boyfriend or family.

First, YOU don't know what was going through her mind or how she was dealing with her hormones when she did this. The most plausible explanation is that she was not thinking, just reacting to what was going on.

I am not condoning what she did. It was terrible but there ARE mitigating circumstances. A premature birth is actually harder on the body than a full term birth. I can't imagine going through that and being able to make a rational decision afterward.

Just because ONE mother reacted badly does NOT mean that the law is not working. My father is a fireman in Houston and they weekly have a mother or couple dropping a child or more off. People DO know about the law, it is advertised, and people ARE utilizing it.

Peace,

Jenn