Shouldn't we rename the JPA/JPAS to be more inclusive?

I like Affiliation too. As in Jewish, Pagan & Friends Affilation. (JPFA). We could add the E in there for JP&F Educational Affiliation (JPFEA).

I'd like to include others with similar issues of being bashed & similar desire to support "education".

We need to be careful though, not to extend too far. There are a lot of people in R&S. I don't go near the Christian/Atheist/Mormon/JW's battling.

Right now one of JPA (JPFA?)'s prime charter is to assist smaller groups that don't have the numbers to add information if they don't alert each other & to stay away from other major hot zones. I'd like to not lose that part of the charter by turning it into an overall anti-bashing, self-vigilanti group for all of R&S. It's likely to become as untenable as the whole place was to begin with.

Our limited charter now seems to be working & could benefit from adding any other smaller groups & like minded folks who specifically ask.

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On Our Bashing:

What I've noticed is that we sometimes jump to the conclusion that we need to provide the "messanic jews aren't jews" argument, to people who aren't thinking that way & are geninuing asking about Judaism vs. Christanity. Our answers then especially comes across as Christianity bashing & not very useful to the asker. (Both of which are the opposite of our goals.) It's hard not to get side tracked after a day with trolls...

Also, some of the terms we'd adopted are loaded. For Christians, terms like man-God, Jesus=basphamy are off-putting for good reason. So as much as we can find good, neutral ways to get these very hard arguments made...

Even for Tanach to OT, I was thinking of switching from "mistranslations" to "OT has differences which support Christian theologies", except when the literal mistranslations matter. I'm finding this concept is hard for Christians to swallow the first time they hear it & they think we're nuts & just bashing on them (at least from PMs I've gotten.)

We also each need to be less afraid to politely comment if one other of us has gone overboard, in the answers themselves (or in PM). It's hard to do because we like each other -- If we all know to take it in the spirit intended, it should go fine. I do see things that make me cringe & I'm sure I've said things that had others shaking their head.

So, my two cents.

Haha , Paperback already told me she was thinking of that..

You have a very good point , you know. That is the very reason why I left the JPA - I'm neither Jewish nor Pagan , and I didn't feel JPAS actually made the person part of the group. 'JPAS' only gives the feeling that one is just a 'supporter' - not a member - you know what I mean?

But you know what else should be made an important point for the group - especially since it's now in the process of 'reforming' to be more inclusive? The members should start taking care not to bash any other religions. I know this might sound very obvious. But I've found the JPA to be a little anti-Christian , although not always deliberately so.

And not all Messianics are bad , you know. I've managed to come across one , who doesn't claim to be 'Jewish' , he only ever calls himself 'Messianic' , and he didn't even try to convert me when I told him I didn't want to be converted.

So if the JPA really wants to change and become more inclusive - the members must try to at least SOUND more tolerant of Christianity. (I'm saying Christianity because that's that's the religion that is so often made to sound ridiculous by the JPA).

Before the JPA changes its attitudes , I'm not re-joining , despite all the many people who have told me that I'm welcome back.

Hm, at first I was thinking nothing was wrong with the name, because the purpose of the group is to ally individuals to support Pagans and Jews, and create and exchange of learning - however, since the group does not have a policy of exclusion (all religions are viewed with acceptance and tolerance - except in some circumstance, Christianity, but it has been recognized that that attitude must change), perhaps "Alliance" is the wrong word.

I propose the word "Affiliation" be used instead. It has less inclusionary connotations, but at the same time it stays true to the goal of specifically helping Jews and Pagans - it just better implies that other religions are accepted. After all, the goal is to specifically help out Jews and Pagans, even if other religions are accepted as affiliates to this goal.

Also, the word affiliate better describes the relationship between Pagans and Jews in this group - it could dispel the notion that the actual RELIGIONS are allied into some sort of new, "Jewish Pagan" religion.

PS: I;d like to note that I dislike the term "Jews, Pagans and Allies", since the word "Allies" has the same connotations of exclusionary terms as "Alliance".

I'm seriously pushing the word Affiliation, I like it a lot!

answer: I like Jews, Pagans & Allies and that we reassert that the goal is to educate others about our religions and to learn about others.

Things can get tense at times when people assert their views are the only legitimate ones and everyone is guilty of this. I'm working on the "Patience" and "tolerance" words in my life, honest. I think if we realize everyone has "hot buttons" that just send them over the edge and everyone is human - take a step back, take a breath and try to approach things calmly and logically, we can do some good.

I vote for JPA - Jew, Pagans and Allies

That's a thought. I e-mailed another poster about this very thing using Mama Pajama's answer as well; this poster had an 'ah-ha' moment, realizing what the JPA is all about. After all, perception IS everything.

I'm for it. Perhaps something denoting that we offer something other than misinformation? (I need to think more on this)

That's so funny. Paperback Writer and I were just discussing it earlier.

I suggested that we should at least not put Jewish and Pagan next to each other since a bunch of people think we mean one person who is both.

You won't get many of our Jewish members chiming in today, though. It's shabbas :)

Personally I just about fell off my chair over the UPYOURS.

EDIT:

One of my suggestions was changing it to JAPEA - the Jewish and Pagan Educational Alliance - but that doesn't address the exclusionary issues - only the misperceptions of our goals.

My vote is for Jews Pagans and Allies (JPA)

This isn't really an answer to your question, but something your question brought to mind.

Looking at mama-pajama's answer had me thinking of how we could let interested people like her know more about our beliefs.

I was thinking they could join us for a discussion on one of the Y! message boards?

I know, the message baords do have trolls, but we could ignore them.

I am always checking this board

http://messages.yahoo.com/Religion_%26_Beliefs/for...

looking for interesting discussion, and there rarely is any.

It would be so nice to have really active Pagan boards again, and maybe even see some Heathens there!

Anyway, just a thought.

Your first suggestion of Jews, Pagans, and Allies is great!

I am aware that a few people have been feeling left out; I only found out very recently.

QUA :

We only ever answer in RESPONSE to posts by *some* Christians. We never, ever initiate it.

None of us is 'anti Christian'. Please see my post from the other day in which I was saying how I love some of the Christian prayers, I even named one.

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SOME other suggestions:

JAPAP

Jews And Pagans Against Prejudice

or

PAJAAAM

Pagans And Jews And Allies Against Misinformation

I think it's doing fine as is, really. No need to confuse people.

I've learned a lot from the JPA.