Why is there so much controversy over whether or not Christmas is Jesus' birthday?

Who is arguing over it? It is a known fact that jesus was not born on december 25th and the pope just lied about that to make Saturnalia a christian holiday and get pagans to convert to christianity.

Simple....

Can a Pagan Holiday Be Made

Christian?

DURING the winter of 2004, the Christmas season in Italy was marked by a lively debate. Some educators and teachers supported the idea of reducing to a minimum or even completely eliminating any reference to religious Christmas traditions. They advocated this out of respect for the increasing number of schoolchildren who are neither Catholic nor Protestant. However, others in scholastic circles and elsewhere demanded that the traditions be respected and fully preserved.

Aside from this controversy, though, just what are the origins of many of the Christmas traditions? As the debate was reaching a climax, the Vatican newspaper L’Osservatore Romano made some interesting observations.

The sun god

Regarding the date when Christmas is celebrated, the Catholic newspaper said: “The real date of Jesus’ birth, from the historical viewpoint, lies concealed beneath a veil of uncertainty as regards Roman history, the imperial census of that time and research in the subsequent centuries. . . . The date of 25 December, as is well known, was chosen by the Church of Rome in the fourth century. This date in pagan Rome was dedicated to the Sun god . . . Although Christianity had already been affirmed in Rome by an Edict of Constantine, the myth of . . . the Sun god was still widespread, especially among soldiers. The above-mentioned festivities, centred on 25 December,

There isn't any "real" controversy; Christian Biblical scholars almost unanimously agree that December 25th is not the birthday of Jesus.

There is also no debate that December 25th was picked by committee. The only thing up for debate is the motivation behind picking that specific date. Whether it was done cynically to aid Christian conversion efforts among the pagan Romans or it was simply a convenient coincidence, one cannot argue with the success of the choice.

I don't see why there is so much fuss, Christians often say that everyday should be a celebration of their Lord, getting hung up on the one day seems a bit petty to me.

Because contrary to popular belief, Christianity didn't become the biggest religion because it was such a great idea and everyone fell in love with it. They killed off or threatened their competition, destroyed their sacred sites and art, and as the final insult to injury "Christianized" all their holidays and the traditions that went along with them.

I personally have no problem with Christians celebrating whatever they want, until they get on some high horse and say that their god is the only "reason for the season" or start crying persecution because someone tells them Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas. If they want to throw that "War on Christmas" BS at me, they're going to get a mini history lesson. :)

That and modern-day Pagans still celebrate the old holidays and are tired of monotheistic ignorance, which seems to know no bounds in December. Celebrate whatever you want, but don't act like you invented it, that's all I ask. Just a little intellectual honesty. :)

So theft is not a crime then?!!

Christan's have deliberately set out to steal Christmas, Easter and Halloween from the pagans!!!

Christmas is nothing to do with either Christianity or Islam but it does have it's origins in the midwinter festival and many other basically pagan rites but since much of it is a celebration of nature rather than religion everyone should be able to enjoy it and be happy together despite religion!!

The ancient European pagans celebrated the midwinter festival and a number of other festivals long before Christianity ever existed!

Babylonians celebrated the feast of the Son of Isis with gluttonous eating and drinking, and gift giving and the goddess of fertility, love, and war.

The Romans held a festival on 25 December called “Dies Natalis Solis Invicti, celebrating their own god Sol Invictas - PAGAN.

The Persian god Mithras, the Syrian sun god Elah Gabal, the German Sol, the Greek Helios and the Mesopotamian Shamash. But also Saturnalia, honouring Saturn, the God of Agriculture. The law courts and schools were closed. No public business could be transacted an this is where the holidays originated - ALL PAGAN!!!

Wax tapers were given by the more humble to their superiors. The origin of the Christmas candle - PAGAN!!

In Rome groups of costumed went from house to house entertaining their people. And this was where the carolling Christmas tradition originated PAGAN!!

Statues of the Mother and lover or Mother and son were paraded through the streets not only in Italy but also in Africa, Spain, Portugal, France, Germany and Bulgaria. Thus, the symbolism of the Heavenly Virgin and the infant child paraded on a yearly basis are not of Christian origin. They stem from the Mother-goddess religion, which is very ancient ENTIRELY PAGAN!!.

Scandinavian countries celebrated Yule honouring Thor - PAGAN.

In Germania (not Germany) they celebrated midwinter night followed by 12 wild nights of eating and drinking. The 12 days of Christmas PAGAN!!

The church under Pope Julius I declared that Christ’s birth would be celebrated on December 25 in 350 AD in order to try to hijack the PAGAN festivals but it was largely ignored. Christians did not really celebrate Christmas until 378 but it was then dropped in 381 and not resurrected until 400.

The Christmas tree stems from pagan tradition and ritual surrounding the Winter Solstice, which included the use of holly boughs ivy and other foliage as an adaptation of pagan tree worship. Holly and ivy represented male and female. Mistletoe was considered a sacred plant, and the custom of kissing under the mistletoe began as a fertility ritual - all PAGAN!!

Santa Claus came from the Dutch “Sinterklaas” and was a tall figure riding a white horse through the air and usually accompanied by Black Peter, an elf who punished disobedient children. Also the origin of the reindeer, sleigh and the elves ALL PAGAN!!

The modern red coated Santa was brought about by coca cola!!

America actually banned Christmas several times and is the originator of the expression “Happy Holidays” which came about because of the pagan origins of Christmas to include all religions and traditions!!

The Venerable Bede, an early Christian writer pointed out that the Christian church absorbed Pagan practices when it found the population unwilling to give up the festivals. Thus a lot of what Christians now see as Christians practices are in fact pagan!!!

Christmas is the time of year christians strive to prove just how pagan they have become!!!

Think about it this way; God had a book written specifically for us (the bible). In His book it explains the way in which we should worship Him. In essence, the meaning of religion is the worship of God. God is a God of truth, right? - John 4:24. God does not approve of idolatry, right?--2 CORINTHIANS 6:16. God does not approve of sharing his worship, right?--.Deuteronomy 4:24 God's word says to remain spotless from the world, right?—Jas. 1:27

So just with these few scriptures,(and there is thousands more) we get an idea of what God requires for an obedient servant. Christmas is rooted in paganistic worship of other Gods.... that violates all the above scriptures.

Plus on top of that. There is no record of Jesus birth. If God deemed it important, He would have recorded it for us. But Jesus death is recorded in the Bible and that we observe yearly.

Side point. There are 2 birthdays recorded in the bible. Both ended violently. The fact that no other birth-dates are recorded with a positive view tell the readers that God really doesn't think too kindly on celebrating birthdays. This too, true Christian take into account.

Foot step of Jesus, take God's word the bible seriously, and preach to others about the truth that will set men free.--John 8:32

You've got the right idea, but it is important to remember His birth, and the traditional day to commemorate this important event was chosen to be a couple days past the Winter solstice. Most likely the event was several months later (early April, some say), but we don't even have the calendar year right -- the biblical account had to occur several years BC because of the dates given (Caesar Augustus' decree for taxes and census, for example).

So, the exact day doesn't matter, and I've not heard "so much controversy" over this issue. I'll go with the convention and just because it's got tradition behind it.

No one really cares until the bible thumpers start demanding that christmas is the only holiday being celebrated during the holiday season. The fact is that Yule, Saturlina, Hanukkah and many other holidays predate Christianity. dec 25 was chosen for Christmas only because the early church wanted to force Pagans to celebrate something christian in place of their traditional celebrations.

Celebrate Christmas any time you want, just don't tell me I have taken Christ out of Christmas because I celebrate Yule, or because I say happy holidays instead of Merry Christmas unless I know you are Christian.

Jesus was not born on the 25th of December. The Holy Spirit said that God is glad even though the date His birth is being celebrated is wrong because “the spirit [of the celebration] is for the true Savior or the Covenant of God.”

Would you believe that Jesus was actually born on May 23, 33 BC? The date came from no other than the Holy Spirit. I checked it up only from 2004 to 2006 and found it to be correct. I heard the date May 23 birth in June 1983 together with His crucifixion on August 17.

The following is a summary from http://www.geocities.com/peacecrusader888/birthmay...

THE BIRTH OF JESUS

(May 23, 33 BC)

March 29, 33 BC (Nisan 14, 3728) – Friday - King Herod ordered the burning of Matthias and his companions alive for raising the sedition.

March 30, 33 BC (Nisan 15, 3728) – Saturday – Eclipse of the moon, 11:13pm; Jewish fast.

May 18, 33 BC (Sivan 5, 3728) – Saturday – Jewish Sabbath.

May 19, 33 BC (Sivan 6, 3728) – Sunday – After the Sabbath, Joseph and Mary departed from Nazareth for Bethlehem.

May 22, 33 BC (Sivan 9, 3728) – Wednesday – They arrived in Bethlehem. No one of Joseph’s kindred admitted them even though he descended from the royal line of King David and Mary was very pregnant. Why? Because they were poor. They found a cave, a shelter for farm animals, at the outskirts of the city where they stayed for the night.

May 23, 33 BC (Sivan 10, 3728) – Thursday – Jesus was born after midnight.

May 30, 33 BC (Sivan 17, 3728) – Thursday – The baby was circumcised and named Jesus.

June 6, 33 BC (Sivan 24, 3728) – Thursday – Arrival of the three kings in Bethlehem to pay homage to the Infant Jesus. They were kings whose names were Balthazar, Gaspar, and Melchor, who came from three different kingdoms in the East – Sheba, Arabia, and Persia – and just met along their way to Jerusalem.

July 2, 33 BC (Tammuz 20, 3728) – Tuesday – 40th day of Mary’s impurity.

July 3, 33 BC (Tammuz 21, 3728) – Wednesday – Purification rite of Mary and presentation of Jesus at the Temple in Jerusalem; departure for Nazareth.

July 4, 33 BC (Tammuz 22, 3728) – Thursday – Flight of the Holy Family to Egypt by night to escape the slaughter of the innocent ordered by King Herod.

July 5, 33 BC (Tammuz 23, 3728) – Friday – Slaughter of the innocents.

July 12, 33 BC (Av 1, 3728) – Friday – First day of the first month in the Jewish religious lunar calendar; New Moon Festival.

July 13, 33 BC (Av 2, 3728) – Saturday – Death of King Herod.

Sometime in August or September but before winter – Return of the Holy Family to Nazareth from Egypt.

I do not force anyone to believe this but I honestly tell you that I would have withdrawn my belief in Him had I proven Him wrong. You wouldn’t even hear me talking about the Holy Spirit here or anywhere else.

Who could be correct in both birth (May 23) and death (August 17) of Jesus?

So the date you are looking for is May 23. No Santa Claus there, please.

With love, your brother in Jesus,

Aristeo Canlas Fernando, Peace Crusader and Echo

Motto: pro aris et focis (for the sake of, or defense of, religion and home)

http://www.geocities.com/peacecrusader888/

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