Do "messianic jews" read the Torah portions as divided up by the Rabbis?

Actually, it's an excellent question, allonyoav!

My congregation uses the readings listed on the calendar we get from Israel, so I'm honestly not sure if they are listed by Rabbis or not. Wish I did know! I will tell you what our reading is for tomorrow and you can say whether you have them as your reading or not. How's that?

VaYetze

("And he went out")

Haftarah:

Gen. 28:10 - 32:2 (3)

Hos. 12:13 - 14:9

*************************

Sugg. N.T.

John 1:43-51

I'm sure the second portion won't be in your reading *grin*, but we believe the entire Bible is inspired by the Most High God.

Thanks for the question!

D1

Well, first off- a real Rabbi has spent timelearning Judaism in an yeshiva. Messianic ministers (I refuse to even offhandedly refer to them as Rabbis) are Chhristians who have studied Christianity and then learnt how to shoehorn Chrsitianity into a warped conception of Judaism. In short- Rabbis are Jewish- Messianic community teachers are Christians with warped and peculiar ideas about Judaism.

Why does someone who nicknames himself as someone who does not care anymore, care so much about other people's supposed blindness, but not their own blindness? Why is someone blind, because they believe that their "heavenly Father", the God of Israel or the Jews, the God of the Tanakh and the Torah is savior, but they do not make a god out of some messenger that only a few people who wrote a few "books" supposedy knew? And that messenger supposedly also called the God of the Jews his Father?

Actually the questioner asks an open question about what "messianic Jews" read (he also says 'they' and not 'you') and so anyone can answer. Especially since it is no secret and especially since "messianics" are not a homogenous group (except for varying degrees of belief or differing beliefs about Jesus and the NT). In fact, Ruth seems to provide more knowledge and more insight than a few other answerers did. Not only is there contradictory beliefs about "messianic "Judaism" Christianity, but as we see there are some Christians who call themselves "messianic Israelites", some who believe Jesus or Yeshua was not a Jew and some who believe in a "2 House Theory". But with his attitude and the thousands of different "orthodox churches" or belief systems in Christianity or "Israel", it is going to be quite difficult to get "Israel" or "Joseph" or the house of "Ephraim" to unite, much less unite with "Judea" or the "Jews".

The Jews are there to uphold the Torah, the Tanakh, and tell us about the messianic prophesies that have not been fulfilled. They are like Elijah standing against the priests of Ba'al and telling us also that God is not in the wind, the fire, or the earthquake (symbols for those who will see), but in the still, small voice (drowned out by the noisy preachers and the anti-messiahs). They are there to tell us of Torah and shining the light of Sinai. You will grab a hold of their tallit; they are not there to compromise it all away to agree with the wayward Israelites who followed ba'al or with Rome and Greece or with the "churches of Babylon".

Yes, we do.

And, Devoted1 said pretty much all I wanted to say.

I dont know why ppl still need to put others down that dont believe the same as they do.

To label a whole group of people MJ's as dishonest is very wrong. God YHWH is not into labeling others this way. It is bigotry and it is ppl speaking that do not understand what they are speaking.

Yeshua, who most call Jesus, as the true Jewish Messiah, even tho many of them dont know HIm yet.

Good good news, tho.

As many of the Jews are coming to find the Messiah in these last days, as the Bible says will happen.

And, good good news again,

as many that have always been believers, that did not understand their Hebrew roots, are now findinbg the true Sabbath, The feast days, etc.

As the Bible says, we shall become in one.

Its happening now.

WE have much to celebrate.

And, remember, He is coming soon.

Full Gospel SHirley

You have a good question, too bad its a baited question as can be seen from all of the answers before me.

I believe that our congregation does use the Torah portions that are set by the Rabbis, but I'm not 100% certain.

They have a good set up for doing the Torah portions. Why not use a good thing.

Is there anything wrong with that? We also use some of the blessings in our services, is that a crime too?

Just because I don't agree with everything that the Rabbinical system teaches and does, doesn't mean that its totally bad and should be avoided completely. There is much good knowledge with these people. I just don't accept all of it. I am very willing to discuss the Torah and the different understandings that we have. There is so much to learn and knowbody has all of that knowledge.

Unfortunately, the JPA refuses to "sit down" and talk about the things that we DO agree on and then work from there. This is a very closed minded group that refuses to budge from their "understandings" of Messianic's. Too bad.......

Hey Dev Brit... how many Messianic Jews have you actually met? None I bet. You don't have a clue do you?

It seems that so many of these bitter people don't want to even try to see where the other side is coming from. All they claim is that the few prophecies that they claim are for Messiah haven't been fulfilled yet, they refuse the 100's of other prophecies about Him.

What makes you think that Rabbis have ANY authority to do ANYTHING on behalf of Scriptural Judaism that Messianic Jews would feel compelled to follow?

Sure, Rabbis have every right to lead the Rabbinic community to where ever they want as the diversity among Rabbinic Jews ranges from Ultra Orthodox to Atheist Jew. However, Rabbis can't follow Jewish scriptures and Zakkai at the same time.

Everyone studying Jewish history realizes the major changes away from scriptural Judaism at this time.

1. Solomon's Temple was renamed Herod's Temple and then later destroyed

2. The high priest was chosen by Roman and then later the proof of lineage back to Aaron was destroyed. Anyone saying differently will have to prove it as talk is cheap and is all Rabbinic Jews can do.

3. Rabbis can't hear the voice of God or the Spirit of God without becoming a prophet and proving the age of the prophet never ended and the age of the Rabbi never began. Therefore,

a. Rabbis have no first hand knowledge of the God of Israel including the fact that they have NEVER had God answer their prayers.

b. Had God answered a prayer, Rabbis would know what God created them to do but they have no such answer and, therefore, can tell anyone what God made and commissioned them to do.

c. Instead, Rabbis are forced to perpetuation their ignorance of God by quoting other Rabbis with no first hand of God instead of interpreting scriptures and the prophets as being historically accurate.

4. Zakkai was the pacifist who recommended Rabbinic Jews celebrate the Passover as slaves to Egypt instead of as a free people in Israel. Like a good businessman, when no one in Jerusalem followed his teaching, he faked his death and went to Rome and cut a deal with the general who was responsible for killing about a million Jews.

I challenge any Rabbi to name ONE pacifist Jewish hero before Zakkai that he could have modeled his Judaism after. Name ONE.

1. Was Moses a pacifist recommending Jews live in peace with Egypt? No

2. Was David a pacifist recommending Jews cut a deal with Goliath so he could run a school? No.

3. Did Gideon say, "'Oh, my lord, if HaShem be with us, why then is all this befallen us? and where are all His wondrous works which our fathers told us of, saying: Did not HaShem bring us up from Egypt? but now HaShem hath cast us off, and delivered us into the hand of Midian.'" http://hareidi.org/bible/Judges6.htm#1 Yes. But this didn't keep the God of Israel from speaking personally to him or make him a pacifist for Zakkai to model his unique form of Judaism.

4. Was Esther a pacifist recommending the Jews scattered abroad who survived Haman's hangmen to go to her school to teach them do what they have already done...survive without God's assistance. No, so Esther can't be the model Zakkai patterned his unique version of Judaism.

(BTW: Since she was Jewish, Rabbinic Jews must say that Ahasuerus' children by her were Jewish to be consistent.)

5. Did Elijah admit that he must be wrong about the God of Israel because the entire nation of Israel abandoned God's covenant with them? No. And this didn't make him a pacifist from which Zakkai could model his unique form of Judaism.

Name the pacifist in Jewish scripture that you can say, "The father of Rabbinic Judaism modeled his understanding of Judaism from.....???"

No, Zakkai deceived the Jews in Jerusalem to become a pawn of Rome who was murdering the Jews. And Rabbis have been comfortable ever since celebrating the Passover as slaves of other nations to the point that the Jews in Babylon, Spain, Germany, and Russia went to horrible deaths with very little resistance....pacifists who say they can't hear the voice of the God of Israel.

So why would Messianic Jews who hear the Spirit of God need to follow the Rabbis who are totally and completely ignorant of God when first hand knowledge of God is available? No educated person would want metaphoric Rabbinic answer when knowing the inner peace of standing in God's presents goes beyond what anyone can imagine.

Your question lacks logic, a knowledge of Jewish history, and an understanding of Jewish scriptures.

Hope this helps

All I can say is that Jesus is the real Jewish Messiah, weather you believe in Him or not.

While we're waiting for our Messianic friends to answer, let's just note:

Messianics are very, very welcome to convert TO Judaism.

They choose not to, they choose to remain devout Christians.

That's fine, of course. But they must stop posing as 'messianic jews'.

The “messianic jewish” movement seeks to make Christianity more appealing to Jews, by appearing ‘jewish’.

The basic premise is that a Jew who becomes a Christian doesn’t have to give up their Jewish identity. No – instead, they become a ‘messianic jew’. (or ‘completed jew’, to be more obviously insulting)

And the fact that Judaism itself says this is not true? Oh, well, that’s irrelevant.

Messianics claims that they – not Torah, not Judaism, not Halacha – now get to REdefine who is and is not a ‘jew’.

Currently, the “messianic jewish” movement is funded by Christian denominations such as the Southern Baptist Convention, the Church of the Nazarene, the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod, the Assemblies of God (Pentecostals) and many others.

So let’s call the Messianic movement for what it is:

It represents the most dishonest attempt ever created to convert the Jewish people.

Father God, I pray that allonyoa would find Your comfort and show the love of you to others. Father I ask that the scales of blindness be removed from his eyes that he should see the true Savior, Jesus Christ. Amen.

Why would WHY even make such a statement?

It is because of people just like him that only wish to insult and put others down, that "I Dont Care Anymore".

I know of some groups that follow the yearly Torah reading cycle of Rabbinical Judaism. Personally I do not, nor do I call myself a Messianic Jew.

I don't copy Jewish Sabbath Traditions, My Messiah was put to death because of Jewish traditions that conflicted with Torah.

That is not to say that the Rabbis of old do not have some very important and valid teaching. I just don't think followers of Messiah Yahshua should try to become praticioners of Judaism....because HE did not practice Judaism.

http://www.cbcg.org/franklin/Is%20Judaism%20the%20...

Edit: kosher ninja: In modern parlance, the Jews put out the contract, the Romans fulfilled it.

Edit: Why. Why do you ignore your own scriptures to uphold your personal beliefs? Since the division of the Kingdom after the death of Solomon, when has the following taken place? Please, PLEASE let us know.

Ezekiel 37:15-28 KJV The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying, (16) Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all the house of Israel his companions: (17) And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand. (18) And when the children of thy people shall speak unto thee, saying, Wilt thou not shew us what thou meanest by these? (19) Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand. (20) And the sticks whereon thou writest shall be in thine hand before their eyes. (21) And say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen, whither they be gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: (22) And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all: (23) Neither shall they defile themselves any more with their idols, nor with their detestable things, nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God. (24) And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them. (25) And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever. (26) Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. (27) My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people. (28) And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.