What do you think of George Foreman's list of the Top 10 Heavyweights ever?

George is a nice guy but, sometimes, I think he just says things that he things the general public would agree with, rather than what's really true or even what he really believes. I've always liked him but this list reminds me of some of the things he used to say when he commentated for HBO. Some of what George says just doesn't make sense.

It's good to show some of the old champions the proper respect. However, I really don't think George believes that John L Sullivan belongs on ANYONE's list of Top 10 Greatest Heavyweights. The ONLY way Sullivan belongs on any list is if you're basing your rankings on Historical Significance. There, he gets credit for being the "First". The truth is that he was the LOSER in the First Gloved fight for the title. He WAS heavyweight champion, as society saw it then but there is NO WAY any modern "expert" can even compare all that grabbing and hugging they did to today's "Boxing".

True, the bare knuckle fighters were tough. You'd have to be. However, rounds, before the MQ rules, were not 3 minutes. Fights were not always fought under the same or even similar rules. The rules depended on Where the fight took place and WHO was fighting. The rules didn't always apply to both fighters.

My rankings are based on a fighter's IN THE RING accomplishments and skills. When I compile a list of "Overall", this includes Historical Significance. However, on my IN THE RING list, which counts more, as far as I'm concerned, there is NO WAY Sullivan, Dempsey or Tunney would rank very high. Dempsey barely makes the TOP 12 on my list and Tunney (a great boxer but only a "good" heavyweight), just misses it.

The ONLY champion, before Johnson, who has a chance of competing with the modern champions is Jim Jeffries. He'd have a puncher's chance against most champions but he would lose to anyone with any skill. Sullivan stood Head n Shoulders over the guys of his day. But, if you put him against modern fighters, even the man who beat him silly, Jim Corbett, would look clumbsy.

I can see ranking Lennox Lewis 3rd and Joe Louis 1st. I don't have them that way but there is a strong argument in each case. Rocky Marciano at #2 is a Stretch. I can see why he doesn't rank Muhammad ALI very high but that's George's opinion, one I certainly DO NOT agree with.

Tyson has a short against ANYBODY before round 5.

If you twist his arm hard enough, I wonder where George would rank himself.

Personally, I don't think ANYONE holds a firm grip in any place in the TOP 12. I have them in groups.

ALI, LOUIS, HOLMES, LEWIS: None of them would go undefeated in a series of fights but ALL of them would hold more victories than those listed below them.

FORMAN, HOLYFIELD, TYSON: None of these champions would go undefeated in a series but ALL would hold more victories than those below them. None of them would have better records than the TOP 4, in a series of fights.

MARCIANO, JOHNSON, LISTON: None of these champions would go undefeated and ALL would lose more to the group above them.

FRAZIER, DEMPSEY: Both great champions. Frazier would score his share of wins over some of the above champions. His record against the Overall, is what keeps him in this group. The same goes for Dempsey, except he would score fewer wins than Frazier.

Wladimir and Vitali Klitschko could break the TOP 12 before they're done. BOWE could have. Tunney is "good" but he doesn't come close. Ezzard Charles comes a bit closer but he's still too small.

Everyone else is clearly below this group.

My knowledge doesn't cover all those fighters, but my particular objection would be Mike Tyson at #4 ahead of Ali?! And Rocky Marciano over both of them! Joe Louis and Lennox Lewis being way up is not bad and maybe you can make an argument that Lennox Lewis is under-appreciated. Or perhaps the list isn't supposed to be in any particular order?

Also, I would have put George Foreman in the list.

There a good list of fighters but not my personal top 10, there are a few in there who shouldn't be, a few who are missed out and a few that are ranked too high/low. JL Sullivan was a bare knuckle fighter who fought under different rules and would be too crude to beat more modern heavyweights, Muhammad Ali should not be seventh (maybe that's some bitterness on Foremans part!) and it misses out Foreman himself, Jack Johnson and Joe Frazier. Also I think Marciano and Lewis, although top 10 heavyweights should be lower than 2 and 3.

Sentiment and hero worship aside this is my top 10 of THE best heavyweights of all time.

1 Muhammad Ali

2 Lennox Lewis

3 Larry Holmes

4 Mike Tyson

5 Joe Louis

6 Evander Holyfield

7 Rocky Marciano

8 George Foreman

9 Riddick Bowe

10 Joe Frazier

That is disjointed enough to be Foreman's list - but I don't know if it really is. I know that he holds Ali up at least as high as Lennox Lewis or Tyson. He also has stated that Joe Frazier was one of the greatest fighters ever!

Foreman just talks and talks, and usually contradicts himself quite a bit. I think that all 10 on that list could be deserving, but I think the order is pretty far off. Using just those 10:

1. Ali

2. Holmes

3. Louis

4. Tyson

5. Marciano

6. Lewis

7. Holyfield

8. Dempsey

9. Tunney

10. Sullivan

I disagree totally. Ali and Louis are interchangeable at 1 and 2. I would put Marciano Tyson and Dempsey lower. Tunney would not make my top ten and I would put Holmes about 4. Lennox would make bottom of top 10 but certainly not number 3. I think Sonny Liston would be a bottom top 10 as well.

Foreman has a great list, however I would replace J.L Sullivan with Big George himself. I believe Foreman did enough during his career to earn a place in the top 10.

I'd place Ali at #1 and rank Holyfield higher. Otherwise, it looks reasonable to me.

Tyson was an animal. In his prime he might have beaten anyone on that list.

I would put Jeffries in the list and take Holyfield out.

The order doesn't make a lot of difference, as to how they are ranked.

Although "Big" George has a solid list of fighters I wouldn't necessarily agree with the rankings of some fighters.