How are Keith Hernandez and Don Mattingly NOT hall of famers? I look at?

A better question might be "how come Steve Garvey is not

in the Hall of Fame? Or Maury Wills?" I think they both

(Mattingly and Hernandez) will be elected to the Hall of

Fame eventually---especially Mattingly, who, I think, was

never appreciated as much as he should have been.

No, Mattingly and Hernandez did not have 500 home runs -- hell, they didn't have 400 home runs COMBINED. Good thing playing baseball is about more than just the long ball.

First basemen have to bring the power, because no matter how good they are on D, if they really WERE something with the glove they'd be playing elsewhere. The 1B's primary defensive function is catching throws -- and that's a real skill, but it is what makes it the easiest position to man, the place where the big guy gets placed to justify his bat in the lineup. (Of course now there's the DH.)

These guys did not bring the power.

Donnie was great for four seasons, very good for two others, and then the back injury reduced him to an utterly pedestrian player. His career arc was the opposite of Koufax's -- started brilliant, took his leave after falling off the mountain, thus no hankerin' about what more he coulda done. And, being a Yankee, he never brought home a title, which in the Yooneevoise is a mortal sin (it's a bit weird that the Yanx had World Series appearances bookending his career). For four magnificent seasons, he measured up -- and then he did not any longer.

Hernandez, pretty much the same, but at an even lower level. Had he not come to the Mets, he wouldn't be half so fondly remembered.

The voters have treated both candidacies quite accurately.

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Chris, this forum sucks for discussion and debate as is, but such is all the harder when you do not read what is there.

While HRs are the bestest form of power, power is not just HR -- doubles (and triples) also count, a lot. Neither man brought power by the boatload that is traditional (and fairly expected) of a great 1Bman. (Note, the career stat similarities between Mattingly & Puckett are superficial, and as a CF Puck gets a different view anyway. A great-hitting CF is much harder to find than a great-hitting 1B.) POWER, not just HR.

Leadership? I refuse to grant any credit for "leadership" unless the player in question actually LED his team somewhere, preferably October. Mattingly never did. So, please!

"Doing everything good" is not greatness, and the Hall demands greatness. Mattingly had it -- for only four seasons. Hernandez? Meh; he bumped up against the underside of greatness, maybe got a handhold in some seasons, but he never got above that into the solid black reliably.

The fact you can name first basemen from today who aren't as good as Hernandez or Mattingly is NOT a case for making someone a Hall of Famer. Neither is the fact they were your favorite player.

Edit: Just because you'd rather have Don Mattingly or Keith Hernandez than Adam Dunn DOES NOT MAKE THEM HALL OF FAMERS. I'd rather have Cecil Cooper at first than Adam Dunn, does that mean Cooper's a Hall of Famer?

And you CAN'T compare stats from of a player from an "offensive" position to that of a HOF player from a "defensive" position and draw conclusions. Otherwise, I could say that Carlos Lee should be in the Hall of Fame because his stats are "very" similar to Yogi Berra's. [Seriously, compare them.]

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