TUTF

Without changing your gender!

So imagine that instead of girls having to be super hot, and men making the money, it was the other way around. Would you prefer all the positive and negative consequences?

Personally, I would LOVE a male gender role. Hot MEN. I would take all the negative consequences easily if all I had to do was earn some money, and men were super gorgeous and gold-digger-y. False rape accusations? HA! For both genders, having your rape not taken seriously is more of a problem! Child support and alimony? I would have all my kids DNA-tested, and get a pre-nup (or I would have a lot of money to attract the mate, spend it all during the marriage, so none to take!). Shot in a war? Sure, if I could have porn, sports, entertainment that didn't include dressing up (fashion) for men, etc.

So would you do it? Flash your male chest and get off on speeding tickets. Get the kids in a custody battle. Get a scholarship based on being male, etc.

It would be interesting, at least.

First off, I'm sick of the argument that Christianity is worst. That doesn't magically make everything terrible by all other religions somehow disappear.

Secondly, I don't understand why people say that Muslims respects women, when I've read so many stories of honor killings and beating women for no reason. Even honor killing rape victims. Whereas the rapists themselves are NOT put to death. I read one story where a rape victim received a harsher punishment (40 lashes with a whip, which can kill) talking to a non-relative male than her rapists did for, well, raping her. They were sentenced to prison, whereas many rape victims are brutally killed.

Yes, the Quran may not support it, and yes, it's certainly NOT every single Muslim out there... It's probably just a small, small minority of Muslims. But again, these things do not make the problem magically disappear. In fact, ignoring the problem, as is often the case when this is brought up, seems to just make it worse.

I just read in the newspaper in order to combat honor killings (for things like wearing too revealing clothing, aka something that doesn't cover them from head to toe) community services are starting to use the same tactics as they use for RIVAL GANGS FIGHTING AMONGST EACH OTHER.

That seems to contradict the idea that women are treated fairly...

So how do people justify murdering their female relatives like this? How come this always seems to be a female problem? You never hear of families honor killing the rapist, it's always the woman who seems to suffer. If women are treated as equals, why does honor killing seem to pop up more for women than men (ignoring homosexuals, sorry, just so this doesn't get off-topic. I mean, men being honor killed for little to no reason. Homosexuality and cheating is considered "legitimate" reasons to kill)?

Well, it's 3 going on 4 years and my boyfriend still doesn't want marriage or kids. I don't really want to pressure him, but I was hoping at some point, he might start to actually care about me and want these things as well.

I'm 25, not getting any younger, and am incredibly ugly. So if I dump him, that might be the last lover I will ever have. However, if I don't dump him, I might have one guy in a billion who might actually want to marry me and have kids with me.

Would you stick with what you got and give up having kids, or risk losing even companionship as well?

Should they STILL have a say in whether the child is aborted or not?

Note that right now men are given (depending on the region) very little say about abortions. And that one of the main complaints is how if a man doesn't want a child, he STILL has to pay for child support. But if a woman doesn't want a child, she can just abort.

Also note I don't really care about the pro-life arguments (that's not the point in this thread). What I am wondering is if we took out the child support arguments (and the pro-life ones) and men are given all the same reproductive rights as women, do you think a man should be have a say in abortions?

Why or why not?

Do you think people would actually start to talk about important issues? (Probably not!)

Do you think it would be more or less annoying if there were misandrist trolls everywhere instead? So far, I've only seen a handful, personally. I'm told they are everywhere, but I really must not be coming on at the right times...

What annoys you the most about the sexists in this section?

For me, personally, the thing that annoys me the most about misogynists is the stupid links they always post to "prove" their point. I'm not going to look through some convoluted website just to prove YOUR point. Provide some damn quotes! And say WHERE it is on the site (so we know you aren't just misquoting).

The thing that annoys me the most about misandrists is how their complaints are always so vague. Misogynists make complaints like "Women are gold-diggers *links to some gold-digging woman on youtube*" and misandrists make stupid posts like "Men can't be trusted." What the **** is that even supposed to mean? In what ways can they not be trusted? Does this imply that women CAN be trusted? Do you have ANY proof? You can't come up with ANYTHING more substantial to complain about? Honor-killings? War-crimes? Serial killers? SOMETHING?!

This could apply to just about every women's or men's issue no matter how big or small. According to a lot of people in this section, because men have problems, women can't possibly have problems. And many of the feminists that people love to rant about do the same. Female genital mutilation? "Oh, much more important than male circumcision!"

Now, I realize that it makes sense to focus on the bigger problem first. But I think arguing over what thing is the "bigger" problem doesn't really do anything. It just prolongs the process and nothing is done while people argue which is more important.

So why do people always have to argue that one thing is more important rather than actually focusing on their issue and REAL ways to solve it? Not enough media attention? Brain-storm some ways to get more attention brought to the issue. How is "Women have more shelters! **** THEM!" really supposed to help? If anything that just makes it HARDER for you since more people are spending time being offended and ignoring the real issue than, I dunno, HELPING you.

Why do people recognize that many women's support groups for domestic violence does not have venues for men (ie they are not giving sympathy and support for men), complain bitterly how unjust this is, just to turn around and refuse to give sympathy and support for women victims? Isn't that a tiny bit hypocritical when you are complaining there is no sympathy/support for men, and then refuse to give sympathy/support to women?

How can one expect domestic abuse towards men to be taken seriously if one is constantly trying to downplay domestic abuse in general? I could also replace rape with that as well. So when people complain that male rape victims are not taken seriously, but then turn around and refuse to take women rape victims seriously. Wouldn't that make it MORE difficult for men to receive the help they need by pretending that domestic abuse, rape, etc. is not really that bad for women (and hence why would it be that bad for men either)?

Why is it that every anti-feminist and/or misogynist is quick to point out feminism's faults, but then DO THE EXACT SAME THING themselves and expect to be taken seriously?

How do you propose that men and women seeking help for male domestic abuse victims either align themselves with already established organizations, or start their own?

In my area, there are a few organizations that specifically help male domestic abuse victims. Do you think the fact there are so many small organizations rather than fewer, larger organizations is a positive or negative thing for male domestic abuse victims?

As part of the GS invasion...

Do you think that if a major religion was created by a woman that there would be as much verses pertaining to men being evil and needing to be subservient, as the current Abrahamic religions have about women being evil and needing to be subservient?

How many people do I have to massacre (like the Crusades, and so on) to "convince" people of this new religion?

As part of the GS invasion....

Who's hotter?

First off, I am going to say I am sick of people reading more into my words than I am writing, and ignoring the actual subject altogether. If you want to nitpick, you aren't actually arguing the content of my post.

Okay, so I notice that many men talking about men's rights tend to also start spewing misogyny at the same time. Just like how you see in many "feminists" (or as they are sometimes called to separate them from feminists: feminazis) talking about women's rights, all the while spewing misandry.

I wonder do they realize they are biasing people against their movements? I have to consciously ignore all the sexist comments by men who say they want equal rights in every area to women (nothing wrong with that!), and then complaining (more like insulting!) about women at the same time. They expect women to support them all the while insulting and generalizing all women! It's ridiculous!

If you want your gender right's movement to actually work, stop alienating anyone that might actually want to help you. You say that you hate it when feminazis complain about all men... Well, you should have enough sense to realize DOING THE EXACT SAME THING is going to get the EXACT SAME REACTION from the opposite sex. People thinking your movement is BS, and thinking you are all just a bunch of sexists. Rather than actually taking a moment to consider the things you do say that are correct! Because it is human nature to remember the negative things before the positive things.

I always see these topics in here complaining about women in here. How they are all like this, or terrible people because one woman did that. But I rarely see anything for men. I rarely see complaints in here like how one guy did this and the poster asks "Are all men bastards like this?"

I'm not saying they aren't there. I'm sure there is plenty of sexism against men hidden around here. I'm just saying from my experiences, I just hardly ever see topics that target men in the same way as the topics targetting women. Again, not saying they aren't there. Just saying I don't see them as often.

Do you think it has to do with trolling? Like people think that women would become more upset at these topics, so it is funnier to torment them? Or do you think it is the same thing these men are suffering from? You notice what matters to you. Men notice the sexist policies, comments, etc. that affect them, and I notice all the topics that affect me (a woman).

I just wonder why there is so much anti-woman stuff in here, and the most commonly cited reasons are that women are all like this or that, or that women don't care about men. But many of these topics suffer from the exact same issues they are saying women are doing to them. It doesn't seem to make sense that someone can complain about something, and then do the same thing, and not realize how hypocritical it is!

So, I am not going to do the same myself. I freely admit there is probably just as many, or more topics against men. I just don't see them as much. And I wonder about what makes up the mentality of the people who make these topics? In another forum I frequent, I notice a lot more woman-on-woman hate than on here. I haven't see a topic like that yet. Again, not saying it isn't there.

Please stay on topic. And don't start blaming women for everything under the sun. I want to know why I don't see more hatred against men? Where are all the women blaming men for everything under the sun? Are they all hanging out in women's studies (as people often blame feminists for all the problems with sexism against men) departments?

I am half-tempted to start making mirror topics for every anti-woman thread I see here, but then I know everything would degrade into anti-anti-anti threads.

Okay, I have said something like this before, but I want to try it again from a different angle. Let's say I won the lottery (I wish!!!), and money was no problem (hypothetically, in reality it really is). I already know that I need breast/butt implants and liposuction (or exercise and breast implants).

But what I need to focus on is my face. Since I literally can NOT walk outside without hearing someone comment how ugly I am! Seriously. No one believes me about this, but I swear it is true. And this isn't even just from straight men, I went to gay bars and heard GAY MEN do the same.

So, first off, I want to know why am I so hideous? What is it that makes me so unattractive? Is it my ****** up looking nose (I think this is one of my biggest problems!)? My big, retarded-looking lips? My ugly chin (I think this is the biggest problem. What do you think)? A combination of the above? I think my eyes are my best feature. But perhaps they are also ugly? Maybe it is separate features, and other features, that I thought were hideous, might actually be okay.

So what kind of plastic surgery do I need? Or can I hide some things with makeup? I am thinking about getting jaw surgery, at least, so I can properly close my lips. Since closing them also makes me looked ****** up, as you may notice by the way my lips become misshapen when I try to close my mouth somewhat. I find that I look less ****** up when I have my lips slightly open. Though, that shows my stupid-looking buck-teeth...

Anyway, I've had troubles with people calling me hideous my whole life. No one would ever try to flirt with me, or date me. No, I am NOT one of those attractive, or even, normal-looking people who are just insecure. I am warning you, I am actually quite ugly!

So without further ado: http://s10.photobucket.com/albums/a131/blueblues18...

or

http://s10.photobucket.com/albums/a131/blueblues18...

What to do? Wear a paper bag?!

Basically, here's the low-down. I look like I've been beaten within an inch of my life with the ugly stick (hence my username Too Ugly To F...). The problem is I am female, and men put a LOT of emphasis on having an attractive mate. Because I am ugly, numerous studies show I am less likely to be hired for jobs and to get promotions. So basically I have no cash for plastic surgery. I am also concerned I might end up looking even worse (if that is at all even possible) after the surgery.

I'm just not sure what to do anymore. I can't even find a prostitute (it's legal where I live, but there are regulations) because even the male prostitutes say I must have big **** and look amazing! I can't attract any men at the bars. Even the beer-goggles don't work.

I've been told my whole life that it's just incredibly easy for women to get laid. But in reality, I find that men do indeed have standards.

I just don't know what to do to attract men. I mean, developing a good personality doesn't really help if guys don't even find you attractive enough to approach (or shy away when I do).

I think I might just give up and go lesbian sometimes. But I can't really attract women either (I've tried)!