Cause and effect?

It's a classic example of the dishonest tendency of some people to demand that opposing ideas meet certain standards of proof, yet being unwilling or unable to meet those standards themselves.

You're right.

Typically, the creationists' argument is something like:

A) Everything that exists must have a creator.

B) The universe exists so it must have had a creator.

C) Therefore god exists.

But A and C logically demand that:

D) If god exists and if 'A' is true, then god must have had a creator.

But the creationist denies this.

They then say that not everything has a creator, god is an exception.

In other words, they concede that proposition A was a false assumption to begin with.

Their entire position contradicts itself and implodes.

The sad part is that they never seem to recognize the obvious deception and hypcrisy inherent in their tactics.

Cause and effect implies time, and time as we know it does not exist; "eternal" implies time as well.

God is not an objectified being "up there" somewhere beyond the clouds, yet God IS there, because God is all. God is, and fills everything real, and what is not real has no existence.

There is no start, there is only now. The "moment" of our creation, and this "moment" of the clicking of these plastic keys, are the same; the first day of this planet and its "place" in space, (which also does not exist), and the last day of this planet, are both taking place now.

People use cause and effect as an argument because they do not understand anything deeply enough to see clearly...but that is why we are "here".

There is the problem of the mind.

First, we are not this mind nor body. This mind is not but the mechanism to work in this reality.

Mind can comprehend (even universal) only what lies in time and space and within the world of duality. Mind is unable to comprehend God.

Our concept and understanding of god is very, very distorted with all religious and self believes. So we know nothing in reality about god. The only way to know god is to merge in him. Be it for a second or for eternity.

In one way we never left anywhere nor we even left god. He is what he is. Only our perception have changed.

This tracking of time and space is in fact an illusion produced by our mind. In some cultures the other name for mind is Time.

Please try to do some practice that will allow you to know beater yourself and that allow you to connect with at least some more pure aspect of life, which will bring you closer to Him.

Good luck.

Axiom: "Whatever comes into being needs a Cause"

Observation: The Universe came into being (Big Bang).

Inference: Therefore it needs a cause. That Cause is neither matter, energy, time, or space. Therefore the cause is supernatural... God.

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On the other hand, God always existed. He never came into being.

So based on the axiom above, God does not need a cause outside of himself.

Cordially,

John

Cause and effect is only free will.

Ability to choose is related to availability of options and free will is associated with the independence to choose.

You to go to the market to buy a shirt, your ability to choose depends on how many shirts are before you to make your choice. Freewill is to choose whether you have the independence to make a unbiased choice.

Take your question to it's logical conclusion. If something needs to be created by something else, what created the first thing? It has to start somewhere, right?

yes.what yousay is true.but a blind man cannot see the beautiful flowers in a garden even though he is told by otherswho have eyes that it is true.similarly to realise something which is so all pervading and which is in you and me it needs some special understanding.

Wat do u mean by cause and effect?

I know that its hard to get your head around the idea that God is eternal, but thats only becoz we as human beings use our minds to much. Always refusing to accept wat is reality becoz we our selves cant get our mind around it.

Lets face it we will never know all that there is to know about our world.

the reason for this sentence could be that the cobra's neck has versatile ribs. The result could be that it may improve its hood. reason being is on account that's describing why the cobra can improve its hood. desire this facilitates! :)

The thing is why do you have to ask people when you can ask God YOURSELF?

SHALOM