Shelters are not overpopulated? they just kill animals?

I am going to buy this book and read it. There's way too much here to give an informed answer.

Thanks for posting. This is great info.

I will say this, I tend to be suspcious of anyone that says No Kill. If they are talking about warehousing every animal in a cage for the rest of its life - waiting for an adoption that will never come, I'm opposed.

Unadoptable animals need to be humanely euthanized. AND you need a RELIABLE test to determine what is unadoptable. Biters are #1.

Another short answer comes to mind - MONEY. If the HSUS funds went to some model shelters and those programs were adopted across citys and states... wow... what a concept! But they don't. I don't know what they do with the money. I was IN New Orleans after Katrina. I did not see 1 OFFICIAL HSUS person... Not one... I can't even get started on them.

As for the rest, my surface answer is - this is interesting. And I personally HATE the HSUS. Peta is in different world, they aren't worth commenting about.

Thanks again for posting.

The governor of Rhode Isand instituted a new law a year or so ago that every cat had to be spayed/neutered. I think a simple thing like that across the board--that every puppy and kitten had to be neutered before being adopted or proof of spay/neuter within 3 months of adoption would go a long way to ease this horrible situation with too many pets.

I have spayed/neutered over 40 stray and feral cats I caught on my own property. I moved in to a house that had 2 mother cats and kittens living under the house. This occured over a 5 year period and for the last 2.5 years I have had no new kittens. Just one person doing that (me) probably easily saved another 100 cats from being born. I don't like the idea of releasing the cats back in the environment, I'd rather they had real homes, but I feed them and they hang out and don't cause any problems. I recently paid to have the neighbors dog spayed. I think it is a matter of education and spaying/neutering. I can't blame shelters because I don't think anyone gets into shelter work unless they love animals, but seeing how animals are treated and how lame the excuses are for people turning in animals must make most people pretty jaded.

I personally think that there should be stricter guidelines for breeders...not just anyone off the street should be able to breed dogs for a quick buck. On the other hand I suppose the pure bred breeds would disappear if there weren't breeders out there!

I almost feel like there should be some type of screening to make sure that ignorant people don't get their hands on some poor puppy. I can't figure out why it is that so many people get dogs and then tie them on short leashes outside and only ever see them when they feed them, I mean what the heck is the point? Anyway I guess the irresponsibility of the public and the businesses( that all mighty dollar) are greatly to blame. Most of the shelters in my area are no-kill so I have nothing bad to say about them.

If there would be a law to stop selling pups in pet shops that came from breeders that would indeed shut down a lot of puppy mills. That is where they do the majority of their selling. The other key to shutting down mills is Good old education. People don't seem to realize what puppy mills are and buy pets from them site unseen and often times when they do see how horrid things are, they buy to 'save' one and all that does is keep these creeps breeding. They don't care why they have sold a pup, they just care that the pup was sold.

The public is largely to blame for shelters. That is a no brainer. Look how many litters are available today in any given breed and in any given paper in the land. Look how many people post on Y-answers daily about their pregnant females with no friggin clue how to breed or raise a litter. Those pups will be sold to the first person who knocks with a fist full of dollars and have the same fate. It is perpetual ignorance.

I haven't seen the book, but I think that banning pet stores from selling puppies and kittens, but instead having a relationship with rescue groups (like PetSmart and Petco have established) will do more to save animal lives than anything else. People often don't care where their animals come from, as long as they don't have to deal with the uncomfortable truth of what the animals and their parents went through before they get them. Which is why puppy mills are so successful. People don't care that the parents are going through hell - they just want the cute, mass-produced, factory-shipped puppies to buy on a whim.

That being said, I am wary of the true motivation of organizations like PeTA and HSUS. There is a difference between "animal welfare" and "animal rights".

Cindy posted--"""AND you need a RELIABLE test to determine what is unadoptable. Biters are #1. """

Absolutely! What happens is that Cute= adoption=money coming in. Way too often biting dogs are put back on the street just because they are cute or are purebred. SO WHAT? If they bite, they go.

Everytime I post this people get their feather's ruffled, but it is true. Shelters are their own worst enemies. They overcharge and kill dogs rather than giving them out to the public. And they worry more about the potential for income than they do about the safety of the public. They have an agenda centered on money not on the animals and not on the public.

Thnks, def a book i want to read.

the shelter in my town is overpopulated, but that look bad, so they put down all the kittens and the cats within 1 day.

so at the end o the month when the manager runs a "managers report" in the paper it says something with the effect to "animal control officers responded to 250 call this month. The shelter housed 40 animals this month, 18 of which were claimed by their owners, and 8 were adopted."

yeah right, our rescue is in the shekter everyother day, what about that litter of kittens that was there yesterday, but mysteriously disapeared...

thnks for the info though.

Banning (or otherwise "encouraging") pet shops to not sell animals is a great idea. Yes, I think it would help in slowing puppy mills and someday putting a stop to them.

Nathan Winograd is the director of the No Kill Advocacy Center. If you are not on his email list, I highly recommend you subscribe. There are also excellent articles on the website.

http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Yes, I think shutting down the puppy mills is a great idea. Since better than 60% of shelter dogs come from BYB's vs. about 25% from puppy mills, there would still be plenty of poor quality purebreds, mutts, and 'designers' arriving in the shelters. Trust me, as much as I love to see animal shelters fold for lack of business, it ain't happening.

Puppy mills have to be addressed before the BYB issue because of several things. First- they're an industry- there are regulations which are repeatedly broken, and if the industry isn't keeping up to standards, it should be shut down. Like all the Chinese factories closing down because of the lead scare. Secondly, although I despise BYB's, most aren't keeping the animals in the deplorable conditions of the puppy mills. That's because people go to the 'breeder's' house, after all, they've got to present themselves as the absolute authority on 'maltipoos' and keep at least their appearances up to standard. You're not going to walk into a BYB establishment and see dogs overcrowded in filthy cages sh itting on each other, covered with mange and other parasites, starving, spinning in circles from insanity. No one would ever buy directly from this. That's why puppy mills have a broker. BYB's issues are more onerous, though, the sleeping illnesses that their poorly bred pups have, no guarantees, the temperament issues that arrive with maturity.

So, I propose shutting down the factory farming of dogs first- just on a cruelty basis. I propose the elimination of puppy brokers- make the pet store go get them or make the customer go to the farm. This would at least force the standards to become better or the industry would collapse upon itself when the truth became more well-known.

I'm not sure I believe the statements made in this book about over-population other than those about PETA and HSUS manipulating numbers to suit themselves. I see with my own eyes what's going on in my own state, county, town, neighborhood. You can't tell me we don't have too many stray cats, poorly bred aggressive dogs, or unwanted pups here in NJ. And I live in one of the more rural areas of my county.

Supply and demand. If the supply is cut off ( as in shutting down pet shops and puppy mills) than consumers will need to go elsewhere to fill the demand ( shelters). In turn, if there are no pet shops, puppymillers will no longer have anyone to supply, thus making business harder for them. The terrible conditions of puppymills make it near impossible for millers to market themselves as breeders...even the average consumer is intellegent enough to notice the disgusting conditions of these mills. I think his argument is logical.