Why doesn't god, in his grace, forgive humanity OUTRIGHT, and allow people to be born without sin?

You got it -- the entire Xian control mechanism would fall apart. But it is part of a cycle.... believe in a sick twisted story, become sick and twisted yourself, and then pass it on to the next generation.

I am going to give this my best shot with the focus on the need for a blood sacrifice. When Adam and Eve disobeyed God in the Garden of Eden (Original sin), with the assistance of the Serpent (Satan) they succumbed to both a physical death and a spiritual death. It was Satan, the serpent that first bridged the divide between spiritual to the physical, thus the sin resulted in both a spiritual and physical death. Therefore, in order to repair this gap, a divine being must take physical form and this was Jesus Christ. Christ, a divine being in human form, served as this blood sacrifice conquering death and providing those that believe with everlasting life. The answer to Why did he do this is found in John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son". We are God's creation, and I do not know about you but you love and protect those things that you created.

Ultimately this is asking for the destruction of sin.

Well that time will come

However, when it does...that means everyone who has sin stains on their soul and the devil and his demons will be destroyed by the Lake of Fire

So even if all babies from now on were born sinless into a sinful world...

Why should they have to suffer?

Further...what about the adults with the sin nature?

Some day Christians will no longer have a sin nature. We will be perfect.

It really isnt that simple.

The only way to get rid of sin ultimately and completely is for it to be destroyed....

And that means that all those who are not washed in Jesus blood...and satan and his demons....would have to perish...because they are sinful and carry sin.

So are you sure you want this? You dont know what you are asking for.

This is just one of many, many logical fallacies in the Bible and in religious dogma.

If God can do literally anything, for any reason he wants, then why was Jesus necessary? People always say, "Because somebody had to pay!" But that implies that God is not, in fact, all-powerful, and is subject to the outside rules of a more powerful force. Because if God could do ANYTHING, he could automatically forgive all sins because he wants to. Or, as you pointed out, he could make us all inherently non-sinful, too.

It either implies that God is not all-powerful, or it implies that God is sadistic and enjoys making himself/his son suffer for no good reason at all.

If, as Jennifer A suggests, God gave us all "free will" so that we could chose to love him, then that still presents the image of a disgusting and ethically twisted God. He created us all so we could fawn on him? What?! So what God really loves is himself, and himself alone. That certainly explains all the innocent little children with terminal cancer and the murders and the wars. What does it matter who lives or dies, when all God gives a rip about is himself? After all, he apparently created us all so that we could voluntarily fawn all over him, because giving us free will because he loves us and wants us to truly experience and enjoy our lives no matter what we define as "enjoyment" isn't enough for him. Clearly he is a selfish and controlling "parent." I am reminded again of the comparisons between God and an abusive partner.

Still, though, even if God gave us "free will" so we could choose to love him on our own, what was the Jesus thing all about? Either God is capable of forgiving sin on an individual, case-by-case basis, or God is not capable of that. Either he NEEDED a "stand-in" to atone for all sins because he is not powerful enough on his own to do his own will, or he had some kind of appreciation for suffering and torture. Oh my god, maybe God is Mel Gibson!

Either way, this is not a deity worthy of worship. It's a sick, twisted mind; or an egotistical, self-loving mind; or a weak mind. Not worth my time, thanks, even if there was any evidence for its existence, and there is none.

As I said, this is just one example (but probably the most glaring and easy to refute) of how the Bible contradicts itself in the most obvious ways. It might as well come with a little arm that pops out when you open the cover, and the little arm hits you over the head repeatedly with a frying pan while it screams at you, "NONE OF THIS IS REAL! THIS IS ALL MADE UP BY DUDES WHO LIVED A FEW THOUSAND YEARS AGO, AND TRANSLATED DOZENS OF TIMES SO WHO THE HELL EVEN KNOWS WHAT IT USED TO SAY! JUST GO PLAY SOME VIDEO GAMES OR MEDITATE OR HUG YOUR NEIGHBOR OR SOMETHING INSTEAD OF READING THIS!"

I bet *that* really *would* be the best-selling book of all time. I know I'd buy it often, as a gag gift.

"Then what would have been the purpose of Jesus dying for our sins then?"

LOL. I hope the guy who wrote this was being tongue-in-cheek. Otherwise, I want to cry with how people in the Western world have been brainwashed to just accept any obvious lie that religion feeds them. People in other areas of the world, you're not exempt from this. You just don't believe in Jesus, so I can't finger you in this statement. You're still just as guilty of believing a bunch of contradictory, irrational crap.

The notion of "original sin" was concocted by Augustine nearly 400 years after Christ so that he could justify his over indulgence to sin.

Romans 5:12 tells us that sin came into the world when Adam disobeyed God.

The result of that sin was spiritual death - separation from God.

The verse goes on to tell us that everyone since then has also sinned.

It does not say, as some people try to force upon the text, that we inherited sin from Adam. That's an assumption that is forced into the text.

In John 3:7 Jesus tells us that "Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit." In other words - when we are born, we aren't spiritual.

Without a spiritual connection to God, we follow the impulses of our bodies. We do what feels good.

There is nothing inherently sinful about our emotions or bodily pleasures. Sin is a commitment to what pleases us without regard to God's will.

Since we begin at birth to do what comes naturally - fulfilling our physical needs - we learn to commit ourselves to our own pleasure. As we grow and begin to become aware that there is something called "right and wrong", that's when we become aware that we have been seeking self-fulfillment instead of God's honor.

That's when we face temptation.

James 2:14-15 says "each one is tempted when, by his own desire, he is dragged away and enticed. Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death."

Notice that the temptation comes first. It leads to sin, and sin results in death.

We do not begin with a sin nature.

Religions: the cults of sacrifice

First you have to make people believe that even their life does not belong to them, but to God. Then you have to make them believe that life is a "gift" they did not deserve and make them feel guilty and forever indebted. Once these premises are accepted, any kind of sacrifice can be asked and nothing short of death will be sufficient to repay God for having been born!

Faith in any kind of supernatural being is a trick of the mind perpetrated on the gallible. It has always served well all those who found it convenient to live and gain status at the expense of the masses. Every religion survives by this method.

These people's answers both make me smile and make me wonder how they are able to live. Saying that you believe in god and then saying random words is not the answer that was asked for. Saying that you believe and that this verse proves it is not the answer that was asked for.

The answer that was asked for was for you to prove with scripture (And only with scripture, none of your trite thoughts) why we are born with sin if Jesus has already died and forgiven us.

Children aren't born sinful--they're born into sin. It's not the same thing.

There are literally hundreds of opinions about what the original sin was. Here's mine. The original sin was selfishness. In the beginning, humans were focused on what God wanted. At some point, we became focused on what we wanted. Once that happened, there was no going back. And selfish people can't raise totally selfless children. Hence the problem of being born into sin. Sin is a product of nurture, not nature.

And God has forgiven us outright in advance of whatever trouble we get into. I didn't do anything to be forgiven. But I did say thanks.

We are not born sinful, but in a fallen world we soon learn how

to sin. By the age of 20, no longer a youth & are then accountable for your own sin.

what is there to strive for if we're given a clean-slate from the start? that's no fun. you have to KNOW that being human is dirty and wrong, and every biological impulse and action is immoral and only leads to gay marriage and evolution being taught in public schools.... and lord knows we don't want that.

the only way to do right by yourself and by your fellowman is by following the direct orders of something that's not human at all. afterall, where else would man have gotten his "morals" had it not been for the advent of the bible? it's not like we have the ability to learn through trial and error, and empathize with those around us...that's just silly.

Children don't have to ask God's forgiveness. God even says unless you come to me as little children you shall never enter the kingdom of heaven. So even if I agreed with you that people be born sinless by the time you reach the age of accountability do you actually believe you would never have done anything sinful? Not even a little white lie? Hey we are all sinners everyone of us. I can live with that. God loves me and forgives me anyway. and when I ask he helps me find a way not to commit that particular sin again. Also to strengthen me to become a better christian in all areas of my life.