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How Could Corals Survive the Deluge?

Somebody else's question got me thinking, but I wanted to give believers a chance to respond instead of just posting my answer:

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/answer?qid=20080...

Now, I don't believe in the silly flood theory, but the answers that try to support the theory amuse me, so I decided to post the above question, as it really does require some intelligence and creativity to state anything other than "god did it."

Corals have photosynthetic bacteria in their bodies that they need to survive. As any experienced marine aquarist will tell you, many corals will die if they're even moved a couple feet lower in the tank, as this diminishes the light received.

If the water level in the world were to be raised high enough to cover mountains, than the light reaching the depths would not be enough to support these species.

Therefore, they would all die. And you can't really argue that Noah kept the frags without aquariums, plankton, powerheads (multiple powerheads would be necessary to create the chaotic current necessary to support coral waste removal and washing nutrients without causing lamellar damage)...he couldn't have dove down to get all of them, and corals can't move themselves to the ark. Nor did aquariums and powerheads exist back then. Plankton existed, but he wouldn't have known about microscopic organisms.

Please support your answers with Biblical references whenever possible. However, if you actually have knowledge of keeping corals, I'd gladly wave this if you can provide details about how you would have done this using the technology of Noah's time (for the purposes of this, we'll say Bronze Age or earlier).

Update:

Littleel: I would first like to thank you. It's good to see a believer at least rise to the challenge of a difficult question. It shows good conviction on your part.

Your answer doesn't really relate to the question though. The question is not about bacterial reproduction; it's about the survival of photosynthetic organisms that would have died, and that could also not have been brought aboard the ark.

So, your answer doesn't work, but my praise for the character you have displayed is honest.

Update 2:

Littleel: Thank you for keeping this alive. :)

Species that have the most diversity do tend to have an increased chance of surviving harsh times, but that's besides the point.

Reproduction requires energy. These bacteria can only gain energy through photosynthesis.

As for low-light levels, think about the deluge. Noah lands on Mt. Ararat, which is 13,780 feet high at its peak (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Ararat). Equivalent ocean depths are in the abyssal zone, which is a region that "remains in perpetual darkness." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abyssal_zone). A vast majority of corals grow in shallow water, and can often be kept in aquariums as shallow as 2-4 feet, often using multiple metal halide bulbs (reference: personal aquarium research & experience). Even the least light-intensive corals typically need 5 or more watts per gallon (which is tall order when you try to figure out a new tank's lighting scheme...and painful when you pay the electrical bill!)

Update 3:

1 – The issue is that corals have requirements for life that couldn’t be met in the deep ocean. The world changes, species die.

2 – Volcanic event block out some sunlight, but not all of it.

3 – I’ve never heard of coral fragmenting when stressed. Normally, the polyps just withdra. When fragmentation occurs, the polyps won’t extend until anchored in substrate.

4 – Spores can’t survive intense pressures. Deep sea bacteria are well-adapted to these pressures; bacteria found in shallow water are not; see http://www.horizonpress.com/jmmb/v1/v1n1/13.pdf for information on this. Use of extreme pressure to kill bacteria, including spore form, is used to sterilize medical equipment (autoclaving).

Update 4:

5 – Zooxanthellatic bacteria, like all photosynthetic organisms, can tolerate short dark periods. Think about growing a plant: it can withstand day and night cycles, but you can’t lock it in a dark closet for 40 days.

Regarding the Titanic, bacteria that need oxygen won’t survive anaerobic areas, just as bacteria that need light won’t survive in abyssal areas.

6 – Ever try to keep corals alive with modern equipment? That’s hard enough for a marine hobbyist; you’re talking about an inexperienced person keeping colonies with only bronze-age technology and no biological knowledge of how they work.

How did he remove wastes from the corals as fast as produced without chaotic currents? How did he keep the wastes from clouding the water? How did he get the salinity right for water changes? How did he keep the water oxygenated enough for them to survive? How did he regulate the temperature? Finally, corals are calcium hogs. How did he dose the water with enough calcium?

9 Answers

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  • 1 decade ago
    Favorite Answer

    Noah was probably told by God of the special protective power He created for the coral by allowing them to create a world of their own inside the coral.The bacteria could not have had much choice in finding a mate outside their family, just as Adam's sons had few mates to choose from in their small world. Biblical stories tell of the terrible deaths and deformities of God's inbred children but often a blessed child would also appear and survive birth and be found to have special talents that saved his brethern.This was God's early plan when men were few in numbers. So the bacteria likely were inbred confined to their coral enclosed world and many mutants would arise and some of these could likely photosynthesize at greater depths of water and so God's foresight again allowed them to survive the flood and later multiply and fill the earth.

    God bless you my son

    ****** thank you***********

    I guess what I mean is that God didn't expect Noah to save all the creatures. But, this didn't preclude God from directly saving the creatures.......they surely were very mutated in their little world and while I guess maybe simple critters don't have sexual reproduction they surely must swap their dna we hear so much about and in an isolated world of the coral wouldn't they have a lot of them inbred mutants and maybe some of them little rascals could photosynthise at lower light intensities and feed them coral folks. I thought I read that somewhere in a book exposin the lies of evolution...called survival of the flattest ? I'll put it in google and see

    ************************************************

    1) How do we have any corals so ? They'd hardly seem the most robust critters from your description. Surely rises of 100 meters of sea level happened after the last ice age...look at the english chanel..french fishermen are often finding tusks of elephants in their nets...it was obviously land once upon a time

    2) What about Vesuvius, krakatoa etc....don't they block out sunlight for years when they erupt...why didn't they kill all the coral

    3) wikipedia says corals can bud off little bits when stressed....couldn't a tiny fraction of buds have floated up and survived?

    4) Don't a lot of bacteria simply form spores to survive ?

    5) How do the bacteria survive the nightime darkness ? Do they feed off stores like plants do ? surely they could have survived temporarily from food stores ? They use sulfur instead of oxygen ....didn't they find bacteria on the titanic that rusted the titanic way below where oxygen could exist ..used the iron instead of oxygen..why not use sulfur in times of crisis

    6) Whats to stop Noah keeping a sample of coral in a bucket in the open deck of the ark ?

    Source(s): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viral_quasispecies seems to be the only link! Pretty much thing it says survival of the fittest is wrong and its the critters with the most mutants survive...like God prepared them for disasters where there was no Noah http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Channel
  • 1 decade ago

    CORALS AND THE BIBLICAL (HISTORICAL) FLOOD

    There are 4 primary assumptions in your question:

    1) Corals have always existed in their present form

    2) Earth has always been the same

    3) There was no flood

    4) Coral is the same as coral reef

    First of all Corals, as we know them, have only been actively (collectively) forming, for about 3,500 years but recorded human history, as we know it, goes back at least 10,000 years. Different types of corals and their growth rate can be any where from .8mm to 414mm per year depending on conditions and type. Corals start out as polyps which float around until they latch onto something (at that time corals begin to grow larger and collect together in reefs).

    Second, The environment, atmosphere, ecosystem, and geography were very different in the pre-flood earth (2 Peter 3:4-7). We cannot take modern observations about environmental, atmospheric, ecological, geological and biological conditions and try to force the primitive earth to fit into it (just like you would not judge the Cambrian era by the Mesozoic era, sorry buddy, that's logic). Before the flood there was a canopy effect (Gen 1:7) around the earth which dampened the suns radiation thereby limiting coral development. While the sun’s radiation may be good for corals it is harmful to humans. Even evolutionists would say that radiation from the sun is intensifying.

    Third corals need salt to thrive (not necessarily survive). The water canopy also prevented the hydrologic cycle which means there was no rain (Gen 2:5). At that time the earth was watered by underground springs (Gen 2:6). Rain is one of the leading ways mineral salts get’s into the oceans from land. Rivers and streams also carry salt into the oceans. Salt also gets into the ocean by underwater volcanic vents and underwater geologic forms breaking, neither of which occurred before the flood (Gen 7:11). The final way salt gets into the oceans is by dead organic matter and before the flood life spans were very, very long and there was relatively little death and no competition among animals so a massive global flood definitely would have done the trick.

    Geological changes occurred as well. Even evolutionary geology recognizes that the mountains and land formations we see today are not the same as would have existed with primitive man due to process of time, glaciers, and plate tectonics drift (Gen 10:25). Mountains are the result of one giant plate colliding with another and the land masses bunching up against each other creating a slow gradual sliding effect of giant slabs of rock. In a Biblical world-view, we believe it is the great global catastrophe known as Noah’s Flood that rapidly brought these changes on. So when the Bible says that mountain tops were covered by the flood waters, you must not understand this in view of mountains we see today but rather much smaller. Its like when you drive through west Texas and tell everyone about the mountains you saw and they laugh because you’ve never seen the Rockies or the Appalachians. Mt. Ararat was not an issue at the time.

    It is common for evolutionary (secular, non-Christian, even atheistic) geology, paleontology, and oceanography to teach that most of the continents we see today (mountains and all) were mostly underwater at some point in earth’s history. Strange that you did not ask any of them this same question since the way they tell it, the water did not just cover the land masses for several months but rather thousands to millions of years (depending on who you ask). Isn’t that less plausible as far as your coral question goes? There may have been a more simplified coral reef system before the flood that was destroyed but that does not mean it could not have rebuilt afterwards.

    I guess it’s safe to say that I wasn’t there and neither were you or the scientists but God was. I suppose if we want any definite answers we have to wait to see what He says about all of this (but then it won’t matter will it?). You can spend your entire life asking questions that humans (even educated ones) can only speculate about or you can start seeking truth where you have it rather than looking where you don’t have it. I think I’ve given you some pretty good food for thought (maybe more than seemed necessary) but now what will you do with it? Look for the next big question? That’s fine, but again, what will you do with the next one?

  • Anonymous
    1 decade ago

    This is one of the best arguments I have read. Really anyone with 2 brain cells gets the idea that penguins could not have made the trip. Only people with a big imagination can believe this fable actually occurred.

  • When the rains started God gave all the Corals hundreds of legs like Centipedes then as the waters started to rise they ran up hill as fast as there little legs could carry them!

    You caN'T TRicK A TRuE beLIVeR wiTH yOuR SaTAniC liEs!!!

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  • 1 decade ago

    I guess those were sinful corals and not favored by God. Then, after the flood, he had to create more...in line with true beliefs, of course.

    Source(s): your friendly neighborhood biology teacher
  • 1 decade ago

    Let me get this straight. You are asking people who are not all powerful and all knowing to explain how an all powerful and all knowing God did something?

    Gus you don't want an answer you just want to puff yourself up and make it look like you have a valid reason to deny God exists. Have fun and enjoy swimming in a lake of fire.

  • 1 decade ago

    Well done here. Science is their greatest threat

  • 1 decade ago

    Brilliant argument.

    Well done man.

  • Anonymous
    1 decade ago

    Dude....NICE!!

    Of course, dont expect to get any actually decent responses...

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