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Why is the Christian definition of marriage relevant to Proposition 8?
Marriage is a secular, legal institution. Atheists, Buddhists, Muslims, Jews, Norse Pagans, Satanists, Agnostics - we all do. It has been accepted that there are no grounds to challenge this.
These marriages have nothing in common with the traditional Christian ideal, with the exception that they are between a man and a woman. Most, clearly, are sexually monogamous - but it is by no means necessary. "Adultery" is no longer on the books of most Western countries, and most states (where it is no longer prosecuted, even if it has remained a statute).
Why should any non-Christian - or, if you prefer, non-religious person - be required to honour this last remaining vestige of religious morality?
I ask this in R&S, rather than politics, because I think there are totally different objections from a political perspective, principally the constitutionality of denying equal rights to a "suspect class" (oppressed minority group).
RESPONSE: People are not required by law to conform to societal norms, since these vary widely. They can change between households, never mind states.
RESPONSE: The word, or the act of, "marriage" does not belong uniquely to the Bible, or the Qu'ran, or any other religious text. The Bible is also not "first" of these texts by any means. If you are referring to to the Christian ritual of marriage - this is not practiced by any of the other groups I mentioned whose marriages are legally defined as such.
RESPONSE: By the justification that marriage is just a vehicle for procreation, you also rule out marriages that involve infertile men and women.
If the "common good" is just about pairing people off into stable social relationships, there is no infringement on this from gay marriage.
Marriage with animals or children is impossible because they cannot consent or participate on a capable and equal basis. The latter is also true of polygamous networks.
Marantha, the word "marriage" comes from an ancient PIE root meaning "young man, suitor"; the concept of marriage dates back to Mesopotamia and Egypt, but the first formal marriages were in classical Rome and Greece. The term was rarely, but equally, applied to same-sex married couples back then.
This style of marriage was identical to that practiced by early Christians - mutual consent in private agreement.
Also, I'm reasonably sure that Christianity doesn't consider the union of two fornicating atheists "holy". It just has no jurisdiction over heterosexual couples.
10 Answers
- 1 decade agoFavorite Answer
Because bigots will take any spurious excuse for their prejudice they can get.
Marantha: Marriage was around in plenty of cultures before the bible was written. So why is it that you can't answer a question without lying? Pathetic.
- ?Lv 51 decade ago
Incorrect. The Bible claims marriage first. Marriage is holy. Marriage is not secular. It is a holy union. In fact, define it. Don't bother, I just did. Holy union.
You switch everything around incorrectly in order to say there are no grounds.
The word marriage belongs to the Bible. This is irrefutable and unchangeable. The Bible has been around before someone else's idea of what marriage meant was applied.
If two people want to unify themselves, that's great. When two people get married, it's a holy thing as well as a unification.
How do you make an unholy thing holy? Not the Pope or even God can do that.
Why should a minister be forced to perform an unholy act against his will? So it can destroy his faith? So it can cause a separation in his church? How about corrupt the entire religion? Lose its 501(c)(3) tax advantage by marrying to an unholy manner?
Look, if two people want to get together, fine. But don't call it marriage. Call it whatever you want. But you can't call it something holy.
I say let the gays go to the County recorder and get unified legally. Can't call it marriage, sorry word already taken by holy book.
The two people get unified, and it's the same thing as marriage legally or secularly. Some people say it's not the same. Well to them I say, well, I guess that's what you should be fighting for, because no matter how hard you fight, you can't make an unholy thing, holy. It's really that simple.
It doesn't matter how many thumbs down I get. Please tell me how God will bless something he sees as sinful. When you can figure that out, then I'll go for it.
My counter response: please provide a reference existing before the Bible that claims the word marriage. Only then can you validate your claim as the Bible not being first with marriage is in the symbolic depiction of Adam and Eve.
Yes, marriage is legally defined by other groups.
No group up to the point of homosexuality has ever involved the joining of two in an unholy manner. In other words all the other groups pass the sinful litmus test. Unfortunately, homosexuality does not. You see the difference?
You can't make sin holy. It should be clear now.
- 5 years ago
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- Anonymous1 decade ago
because
there really isnt separation of church and state.
seeing as a majority of America are "christians"
bigots use this majority to the advantage as "christians"
believe marriage is between a man and a woman.
personally i say equal rights
love is love.
but heres a question in a gay marriage who takes the last name?
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- 1 decade ago
Societal norms.
Those that do not conform to societal norms are by definition outcasts.
If you think that Christians are responsible for societal norms, I would argue that society is.
If society makes laws to regulate itself, to be a full member of this society, people are required to comply with both societal norms and the law.
- 1 decade ago
Because there are more Christians and, as unfortunate as it may be, there are more of 'them' (them being the theists who believe homosexuality is an abomination) then there are of almost everyone else. At least in America.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
Good point.
The "legal" definition of marriage has always exclusively described a union between one man and one woman, because that arrangement clearly serves the common good.
Homosexual arrangements, bestiality, polygamy, and other types of strange (queer) unions do not and cannot serve the common good.
Give it up already!
- 1 decade ago
its bigotry under the guise of religion...as usual. god hates all the same people they do. whadayouknow!
- 1 decade ago
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