Pavel Bure better then jagr > ovechkin > crosby > malkin?

Pavel Bure was the most Exciting player of his time. Don't forget he was a 50 and almost a 60 goal scorer in the Defensive Era in the NHL. Jagr you can make a case for, Because he played during Bure Era and was very Good. Everyone needs to get off the Crosby bandwagon. He is the most over rated player of all time. Malkin is the reason the Pens win. He showed that last year when sidney was out. Ovechkin I feel is the Best player in the Game now. He makes everyone round him better and is just a complete player. Bure and Jagr were way better players then all these guys. They played against the greatest players of all time and had great careers. I'm sorry but I don't feel that Sidney Corsby would do well against a Scott Stevens or Brian Leetch. Ulf Samuson would have run Sid the Kid right out of the League. What about Good old Ray. Ray was the one of the best Defense man ever. Crobsy would have gotten Killed playing against these guys. So with that said Bure was a much Better Player then these guys. I do think Ovechkin and Malkin could have played back in the 90's -00 era but would not have the career they are having. If Baby Crosby Played he end up just like Eric Lindros. Another guy who no one remembers.

Everyone here knows nothing about hockey apparently. Malkin has 10 more points than Sid in 5 more games pretty much even, plus Sid has been injured a bit this year. Teams play their top D against Crosby, not Malkin. NHL coaches know more than you guys. That gives Malkin the worse D pairing to dominate. Crosby doesn't dive... that would be a penalty. When was the last time that he got a diving penalty. To say that Crosby is about himself is ridiculous... how many assists does he have? His blade isn't even curved for Pete's sake so that he can pass better. Crosby is also the Captain he's the only one allowed to talk with the refs in a game. Lastly Malkin turns the puck over a lot more and is not as smart at the game as Sid is. Sid is rarely seen making a mistake. All this Crosby sucks talk is quite bothersome and is usually started by people how couldn't even discern a high stick from icing. Terrible.

If you are merely going to compare personal records from different eras, Gretzky had a 92 goal personal best for a season (plus 120 assists that season). Bure was good, but not in the same class as players like the Great One or Mario Lemieux.

Typically adding better line mates to someone who is already performing well, does not have much of an effect on that player. You said it yourself, 60 goals with a Stanley cup Canucks team... 58 and 59 goals in seasons with the Panthers, a weak expansion team. His teammates had little impact on his stats. Crosby did as well without Malkin as with, Ovechkin did as well without Semin or Backstrom...

Plus, stats aren't everything... Ovechkin gets more goals than the others but with good reason; Look at his division, and the goaltenders for those teams. If you play most of your games versus weak goaltenders, you're going to have more goals all else being equal. Whereas a player like Crosby is in a tough Division. He has to score on strong goaltenders like Brodeur or Lundqvist...

First off.........Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin are 21-22-23 years old and so early in their careers it is stupid to even try to make any comparisons.

Secondly....Jagr> Bure........it is even close to being debatable.

Let me pick apart your argument. A tougher league than today with "CLUTCHING and GRABBING"?

Well, you mention Bure's first two 60 goal seasons........1992-93....let's look at the scoring race that year-

Scoring leaders

Player Team GP G A PTS

Mario Lemieux Pittsburgh 60 69 91 160

Pat LaFontaine Buffalo 84 53 95 148

Adam Oates Boston 84 45 97 142

Steve Yzerman Detroit 84 58 79 137

Teemu Selanne Winnipeg 84 76 56 132

Pierre Turgeon NY Islanders 83 58 74 132

Alexander Mogilny Buffalo 77 76 51 127

Doug Gilmour Toronto 83 32 95 127

Luc Robitaille Los Angeles 84 63 62 125

Mark Recchi Philadelphia 84 53 70 123

Mats Sundin Quebec 80 47 67 114

Where the HELL is the clutching and grabbing in THOSE numbers? Where the HELL is Bure's name? I also see on that list, Mogilny/Selanne with 16 more goals, Mario with 9 more, heck, Luc Robitaille has 3 more.

To be fair, the NHL did decline in scoring somewhat after that year BUT....

Bure's best seasons during that time were-

1997-98- Bure finished 3rd in scoring and Jagr WON THE SCORING race to spite playing less games.

1999-00 Bure finished second in scoring and JAGR WON the scoring race to spite playing in ELEVEN less games.

2000-01 Bure finished 7th in scoring and Jagr won the scoring race to spite playing in one less game. Such superstars as Jason Allison, Martin Straka and Patrick Elias finished ahead of Bure in scoring!!

Bure was a little more than a point a game. Bure had over 100 more goals than assists. Jagr had better points per game averages and this INCLUDES the PLAY-OFFS!

Bure was one of the WORST defenders in the NHL IMO.......I used to watch a game within a game and just watch Bure.........it was RARE to see him venture into his team's end of the ice.........we had a word for those guys when we were kids.........it was called a CHERRY PICKER.......that's right, I said it , Pavel Bure was one of the biggest cherry pickers the NHL has ever seen.

I'm not going to waste any more time on this question because quite frankly, it is not even the same class.......Jagr has quite a few NHL records........he even has some GOAL SCORING records......meanwhile Bure has a couple of franchise records for the Canucks and Panthers! One trophhy mantle is chalked full and the other is almost empty.

Jagr had MARIO...........AHHH.......he was winning his scoring records BECAUSE Mario was not there to win them!! So, that's foolish. Jagr's best career stretch was when Mario was retired.

BTW, Ovechkin, Crosby and Malkin will all eclipse Bure before they are done as well.

Bure played 702 NHL games and had 779 points.

In Jagr's first 702 NHL games he had well over 900 points.

Doesn't take a rocket scientist.

OH SCHIZNIT............I wouldn't even have bothered answering had I known that you don't have a clue!

Bigger nets today? LMAO

why everyone thumb cole f down hes got a point the person with the question got a point it is easier now today with the no clutch and grabing and he still goet 58-59 goals season it only makes sense if there where no grabbing/clutching on to other player he would better because he would just fly down the ice to the attacking end before lidstrom catch bure. He is truely the best skater in the game back then and probably even with a bad knee. Dion phaneuf will be made looking silly by letting bure fly by before he lands a hit.

Bure was a great player, and if he hadn't been hampered by injuries, he would have been considered elite for sure. But the greatest of the great always seem to not get hit by the injury bug. I would not say he's better than Jagr. Jagr produced in Pittsburgh while Lemiux was retired, and he's got his name on the Cup. It's too early to compare Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin. And you have to consider than Ovechkin didn't really have all that great a supporting cast his first three years and scored 50+ goals in those years.

The nets are bigger today? When did that happen? They must be using those in the games I don't watch.

I hate to break it to you, but the nets are the same size today as they were in Bure's heyday. 4ft x 6ft

TB - Bure ranks a distant 5th in the goals/game stats in NHL history

0.762 Mike Bossy

0.756 Cyril Denneny

0.754 Mario Lemieux

0.742 Cecil Dye

0.623 Pavel Bure

Also, the two seasons in which Pavel scored his 60 goals were the two highest scoring seasons in NHL history (and the last seasons before the 'big pad' era) Bure had a lot more net to shoot at than Ovechkin does.

Bure in his prime was a killer. Him and Jagr are 11 months apart in age. So look at the best season of Bure in the early 90s and he crushes Jagr.

I think Bure is the second best goal scorer of all time. He's just not the playmaker that Jagr is/was. The other guys have a lot to prove before they could be better than Bure. Remember Bure played in the old NHL where it was harder to score and 4 power plays a game was a lot!

Mogilney was better than Bure!

Crosby and Bure should not be compared...Bure did not have Crosby's passing skills. If he did, I'm sure he'd rack up the secondary assists too. The exact reason I despise the media's attempts at picking who is better between Crosby and Ovechkin...can't be compared.

I think Ovechkin is showing promise that he is better than Bure, but we shall see. It's too early to tell.

Malkin, it's also hard to tell. how good would he be on a team without Crosby feeding him passes on the power play? Would his numbers be this big?