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How does light travel between stars?

Distant stars in our galaxy do not express illumination to us with threshold intensity for our instruments: at the radius to us, some small stars’ signals are too weak for semiconductors of our finest telescopes – quanta are far too low, but we see them. Far worse, with backyard 3” telescopes we easily observe individual stars in distant galaxies. There simply isn’t enough power generated at the source to reach us in the electromagnetic spectrum. We have absolutely, repeat - absolutely known this for the last century. Occam’s Razor; what we observe is not light, not electromagnetic.

We ‘see’ these stars, so discussion is halted before it starts. ‘Cosmic Lens’ is codswallop: Magic suspends physics so electromagnetics are transmitted without loss or expanding waves - silly. Please see that your astrophysics is a failed and easily defeated model. The first part of Chapter Six

http://www.joebrownscience.net/millennialPhysicsCh...

is different proof.

I recently posted my question but got no answer and witnessed how this issue is kept hidden. Most response was dogmatic, knee-jerk condemnation, and the kindly remainder stopped when I had made my point using their evidence: “How can scientists have stumbled over this mistake for a hundred years and continue to do so for convenience?”

Update:

Drew: the statement stands! There are a significant number of stars that do not produce enough illumination for us to see them across the galaxy, yet we can see them. Period. These calculations were well known a hundred years ago, so how is it that you have not ever paid attention?

Paula: with respect, the point is that you can see them and you should not be able to see all that we can. The illumination physics does not hold up, and again, we knew this a hundred years ago, so why don’t you all know it now?

Mike: may not be so funny in the near future. I’m right.

Lain: it is clear that for most everybody, this is a bit sideways, and again, there is a whole process I’m trying to fight to get this issue back out in the open.

Larry: that is exactly what I am saying, and unless I had a sound and structured model for an alternative that is far better than the tripe you have been handed, the process would be where it stopped fifty years ago or so.

Life: written for a young, aggressive mind, s

Update 2:

(continued) Life: written for a young, aggressive mind, so it has to be fun. The model stands up to far more rigorous scrutiny than does yours, which is my point.

Oklato: Please. This is not a rant and cannot be construed as one. My issue is the suppression of scientific facts, and your process is just one method to do it.

That’s it? That’s all you guys got? OK, up the 3” to an 8” scope, but it still does not wash for the quanta values.

Update 3:

Life: I suppose you still believe the Sun consumes hydrogen and produces helium - you think because it shows up on the spectrum, that is actually happening! You have no idea how ridiculous that whole concept is. Get out of the Dark Ages!

Update 4:

Life: I suppose you still believe the Sun consumes hydrogen and produces helium - you think because it shows up on the spectrum, that is actually happening! You have no idea how ridiculous that whole concept is. Get out of the Dark Ages!

Update 5:

Larry: Perhaps you should move out onto the mountaintops to get better viewing. I have used an 8” in the mountains above LA to view spectacular scenes of galaxies. They are clear and hold thousands of stars. With a 3” telescope, most young eyes can distinguish close galaxies as more than a blur – can detect individual stars. Granted, I had really good eyes back then.

(2) You are correct about the math. This model is more fundamental than you are usually exposed to – it is logic and evidence. The most fundamental math, however is my exact point. Your electromagnetic spectrum math for these stars in our galaxy has been proven to not hold up to scrutiny for the last hundred years, so the only math I cite is something you ignore because - why? Why do you think the ‘Cosmic Lens’ idea was formulated in the first place? It was to explain away why we can see so many stars.

Sunlight is different. We live in the gravity well of Sol, so the rules within that closed system are what you learned, bu

Update 6:

(continued) Sunlight is different. We live in the gravity well of Sol, so the rules within that closed system are what you learned, but are incomplete. We get sunlight which has satisfied all of your experimental data, and my assertion is that to project that data onto interstellar physics is in complete error, as demonstrated by the math of quanta on our detectors – we see far more than we should be permitted to see by the physics of electromagnetics. Again, this math was completed a century ago and has stood. By the time you got an education, it had already been pushed aside. I ask again, do you still think Sol converts hydrogen to helium just so you can get a spectral reading?

Red Rose: Please move on to easier prey.

Update 7:

Quanta refers to quantum mechanics, which deals with the receptors in your eyes, in photographic plates, in electronic detectors. There must be work performed on any of these media to permit us to 'see' a star. At the radii of exposure to reach us for many stars in our galaxy, this calculated quanta number for the telescope, the plate or eye or electronics, is far too low - in levels of magnitude, for this system to work at all. It does work so people ignore the facts. I am asking why and how can this be continually overlooked.

Update 8:

1. The model is as described in the chapters of Millennial Physics. It is by far more complete than the model you learned. It is more precise than the model you learned. It is how things work in the universe. 2 & 5. Math? That’s what is suppressed. The Inverse Square Law states clearly that we should not see these stars, but we do – that’s what I’m trying to get across. Glad you mentioned it.

3. The logic is that we should not see these stars, yet we do. The logic is included in the M-P chapters, and the evidence is included as well. I learned it in the fifties and sixties as a child – inculcated (whoops, a big word) before I was exposed to your status quo. 6. You can see stars because there is a different medium between stars that you have not perceived. 7. I quote quanta because that was how it was presented to me – that there was no way the quanta could be sufficient from these distant stars for us to see them. I write for the future you cannot see, for minds not saddled with your e

Update 9:

1. The model is as described in the chapters of Millennial Physics. It is by far more complete than the model you learned. It is more precise than the model you learned. It is how things work in the universe. 2 & 5. Math? That’s what is suppressed. The Inverse Square Law states clearly that we should not see these stars, but we do – that’s what I’m trying to get across. Glad you mentioned it.

3. The logic is that we should not see these stars, yet we do. The logic is included in the M-P chapters, and the evidence is included as well. I learned it in the fifties and sixties as a child – inculcated (whoops, a big word) before I was exposed to your status quo. 6. You can see stars because there is a different medium between stars that you have not perceived. 7. I quote quanta because that was how it was presented to me – that there was no way the quanta could be sufficient from these distant stars for us to see them. I write for the future you cannot see, for minds not saddled with your e

13 Answers

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  • 9 years ago
    Favorite Answer

    As near as I can tell, your proposal would prevent me from seeing any stars in the night sky. But I can see stars in the night sky. I think it is incumbent upon you - the critic of the existing state of the art - to describe what it is that I am seeing. Please enlighten us.

    You may consider yourself so intellectually superior to the science community that you choose not to submit your idea for peer review. Unlike folks like Einstein, Sagan, Feynman, Bronowski, Bohr, etc - you may not see the need for any scientific approval. Perhaps you have not yet experienced the academic environment that is the basis for such review. Or perhaps that represents too much work. I don't know what your motives are, but you will have to do a lot more than write some self-contradictory statements on Y/A ("quanta are far too low?" - What does that mean?) in order to gain the respect of anyone but yourself.

    ADDED: I am not sure what you are referring to concerning the resolution of individual stars in distant galaxies. I have certainly never had any experience like that, and I use an 11 inch scope. Please clarify what you are talking about, since I perhaps am missing something that you have seen personally? Are you referring to a star or a supernova? Or maybe you haven't exactly seen it personally...

    ADDED (2): And your sound and structured model is...? Your documentation shows no mathematics, just words. I do not understand what you are referring to at all. You are arguing with folks who do use mathematics, and there is nothing wrong with their mathematics that I can understand. You are not helping your own case. All you are saying is that it does not work. Sunlight does not work? I have no clue why it does not work quantitatively. You say the power is insufficient. Show us the math. Prove it. Prove that the Sun does not provide light to the Earth. If it does, then what's different about our Sun vs other stars? If you cannot prove it, then I must take the position that it is wrong. You cannot expect to have such revolutionary ideas accepted based only on your words, right? Your statements are outrageous, but that's all they are. They make no technical sense, and your derision of others ("Get out of the Dark Ages," etc) just reinforces the notion that you are just another crackpot. What is your model?

    Oh - and an 8 inch telescope is also woefully inadequate to resolve stars in distant galaxies. You have perhaps not spent much time with a real telescope?

    ADDED (3): Your tacit admission that you were wrong about a 3 inch telescope, followed by an attempt to cover it up with a similarly ridiculous statement about an 8 inch telescope, casts such doubt on your technical integrity that the rest of your assertions can be treated in a similar fashion. In other words, if you were making up stuff about a 3 inch telescope - and an 8 inch telescope - (which is obvious to anyone who has ever used either one), then you are probably making all this other stuff up, too. It is clear that you are reluctant to admit that you could be mistaken, and that is a fatal character flaw in anyone who considers himself a scientist in even the most shallow interpretation of the term.

    ADDED (4):

    1. What is the model? You say you have one; what is it?

    2. Where is the math?

    3. Where is the logic and evidence? All I see are big words that you do not appear to understand and that make no sense to me.

    4. If the math was pushed aside before I obtained my education (1972), then how and where did you learn it?

    5. This math was purportedly completed a century ago - let's see, that was after Maxwell and after Boltzmann, but before Heisenberg and DeBroglie and certainly before Schrodinger. Who did this math, and how does it negate the Inverse Square Law?

    6. Why can I see stars at night?

    You may impress children with your pretentious baloney, but I am not impressed. This is classic science by intimidation. You just keep blurting words like "quanta" and "electromagnetic spectrum math" until everyone walks away. Most walk away shaking their heads. A few - kids I guess - think "wow." What I think is that you do not know what you are talking about, as evidenced by your statements regarding telescopes. My clear skies happen to be in northern Michigan, with an 11 inch scope - twice the light gathering capability of an 8 inch scope. I cannot see individual stars in distant galaxies, and neither can you. Just because you say you can does not mean you can. Just because you pretend to understand quantum mechanics does not mean that you do.

    Have a nice day.

  • Iain
    Lv 6
    9 years ago

    If as you say there is no light travelling through space, what are we seeing when we look at the sky after dark on a clear night?... The human eye is not the most sensitive light detection system, but it is capable under ideal conditions of perceiving a single photon event. And as for claiming that we can easily resolve individual stars in distant galaxies with a 3" telescope, I have never found an astronomer who would claim that was possible (what are they doing building 8 metre 'scopes with active optics for?)

    I suggest that you publish your theory in a reputable astronomy/astrophysics journal and then we'll see if there's anything to it....

  • 9 years ago

    There simply isn’t enough power generated at the source to reach us in the electromagnetic spectrum.

    Why would you think this?

    ‘Cosmic Lens’ is codswallop: Magic suspends physics so electromagnetics are transmitted without loss or expanding waves - silly.

    There is loss of intensity with distance, but it started out so intense that it still reaches us. By your logic we shouldn't be able to detect photons from the Sun.

    Please see that your astrophysics is a failed and easily defeated model. The first part of Chapter Six

    http://www.joebrownscience.net/millennia%E2%80%A6

    is different proof.

    Is this guy you? I can't imagine that there exist two people that are as deluded.

  • 9 years ago

    I'm trying to understand how your post can seem so well researched and yet be so wrong in its basic assertions.

    Here is a quote from your source:

    "Consider the Sun as I have discussed it in Part II. It has antimatter at its center. Remember that antimatter is any stuff that does not share harmonics with the vibrations of our universe, but is in a separate harmonics universe of its own. The Sun’s center does not operate in real time, but in imaginary time, controlled by activist librarians. It is separated from our universe by its event horizon, which is resonating with the material in the Sun’s surface, and as a direct function of the level of activity of the center’s antimatter. "

    Much of the article reads like this. Just because someone strung a bunch of scientific or philosophical words together doesn't make it right. Actual science must stand up to the rigours of observation, statistics, and peer review. I suggest you study the basic principals of light and gravity from a legitimate sources instead of filling your head with this manufactured and unsupported tripe.

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  • 9 years ago

    You really don't have anything better to do with your life than post so much of this here? If you are right, why not actually publish somewhere sensible rather than writing here just to attack all who disagree with you?

    [Edited to add]

    >>The model is as described in the chapters of Millennial Physics<<

    OK, so it's described in a website. Is it actually published and peer reviewed in reputable scientific journals? Does it in fact have any peer reviewed experimental data to back it up? What I read of that sounds like a load of pseudoscientific waffle.

  • 5 years ago

    You do recognize that coherent gentle is when all the frequencies are in segment with each other comparable to in a laser beam. The light from stars are usually not coherent to start with. We do not certainly see extrasolar planets, we see the stars the orbit dim relatively when the planet passes in entrance or we see the megastar wobble if the planet goes across the superstar from our viewpoint. The doppler frequency shifts of the megastar additionally indicate the wobble if we are within the equal plane as the planets orbits and are not able to see the wobble straight. It could appear that you've been missing a few normal courses in tuition.

  • Paula
    Lv 7
    9 years ago

    You are mistaken.)

    We CAN see stars with our unaided eyes. (only 1cm aperture)

    How much more light does a telescope with perhaps a 3 meter wide aperture gather?

    By the way, we can not resolve individual stars in distant galaxies with a 3" telescope. It takes more light gathering than that to resolve single stars at those distances.

    Occam's razor tells us that the simplest explanation may be the correct one.

    In this case we see stars because of light that they emit.

    Have you got some other explanation?

  • ?
    Lv 5
    9 years ago

    Jimmy E? Is that you?

    So you know who I'm talking about? That's good, but unfortunately, it's clear that you've thus invented a third self that also trolls Y!A. That's such a shame, you were doing so well, Jimmy! What did your new co-worker do to you?

  • 9 years ago

    Nice trolling.

    Now leave, please.

    EDIT

    >>Red Rose: Please move on to easier prey.<< you first, buddy.

    >>There simply isn’t enough power generated at the source to reach us in the electromagnetic spectrum.<<

    Please provide your evidence for this - I would like to see calculations of power at source, power reaching our eyes and the minimum energy needed to get a response from human photoreceptors.

    I would also like to know your qualifications in electromagnetic physics.

    Buh-bye!

  • ?
    Lv 7
    9 years ago

    It gets on a bus. An interstellar bus.

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