Are wins the most overrated stat for a pitcher ?

In the final analysis winning is the only stat that counts.

Statisticians and sabermetric followers have long decried how unimportant a win is. Sadly for them, team sports revolve around winning the game. Some people have become so fixated on stats, they forget the actual reason you play: which is to win the game. When a starting pitcher doesn't get the win, then it's for either two reasons: 1) he didn't pitch deep enough into the game or 2) the other pitcher outpitched him.

Wins shouldn't be the only stat of import. There are tons of pitchers that have had great seasons, who didn't get the wins they should have had. Felix Hernandez, Matt Cain and this season Clayton Kershaw come to mind (who has been better than Matt Harvey and doesn't have near the wins he should have based on his stats). However, wins do matter, because they're the only thing that matters to the team at the end of the year. Should wins be the determining factor when we establish the greatness of a pitcher? No. Should they matter when deciding who gets the Cy Young award each season? Yes. But no more or less than the other stats (IP, ERA, WHIP, K, BABIP, etc...).

Absolutely. Wins are a BS stat. Harvey is 8-2 yet is THE best pitcher in baseball in my eyes. Hiroki Kuroda is only 9-6 but statistically has been one of the best pitchers this year. E.R.A., WHIP, and K/BB ratio are all far more important than wins and losses. A 15-10 pitcher with a 2.5 E.R.A. is better than a 20-5 pitcher with a 3 E.R.A. any day of the week.

Yes, obviously a win is an anomaly in evaluating a pitcher over a short time span.

But over a long career, there are certain milestones you look for on a pitcher. 250-300 wins, an ERA around 3 or below, total strikeouts, number of shutouts etc. Now show me a pitcher with 250 wins and I have to assume he's good, without checking the numbers.

Wins in baseball are kind of tough to understand. It's not so something that you really need to look at when you're judging a player. I think the win is more so something to motivate a starting pitcher to go out and do well. The pitcher wants to get the win. If he goes and pitchers a good game he wants to get the win. It really does matter. It's a mental thing for a pitcher.

I wouldn't discredit a pitcher like Max Scherzer for having more wins than Matt Harvey because Max is a great pitcher in and of himself. But I do agree that the win statistic is the dumbest way to measure the value of a pitcher. If you go back to 2011 when Ian Kennedy won 21 games that year, I knew that he was due to regress the following year because he outperformed his expectations. In my opinion, ERA, WHIP and SO/BB are the more better ways of measuring the performance of a pitcher.

You can certainly make an argument that no single baseball statistic, on its own, tells the full story of how good or bad any player is. You can look at only certain stats and swing an argument any direction you want. However, if you look at all the stats that a pitcher or position player puts up you will get a real good picture of the kind of year a player is having.

I mean you can't argue against somebody like Max Scherzer but a win as a pitcher always depends on the offense behind you. You could let in 9 runs and get the win if your team scores 10. You could let in 1 run and get the loss of your team doesn't score. It gets weighed very heavily and can be pretty frustrating.

There is no merit in getting rid of pitchers' wins. It's just a stat, a set of data. No, the proper approach is to move away from the ridiculous emphasis Ws (and Ls) have -- and here the various media are the most culpable parties -- and start treating them like the mere curiosities they are. For purposes of evaluating how well any given pitcher is performing, several other stats (particularly used in conjunction, and I realize life is much easier when we can look at only one bit of information instead of having to mentally integrate what several are telling us in concert) are far more useful.

Evaluating a pitcher's performance can be likened to writing a symphony. Trying to do this by looking to Ws is more akin to pounding in a hinge with a blender -- using the wrong tool to do a meaningless job, and doing it poorly.

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To the many respondents who are missing the point -- yes, of course it is important for the TEAM to win games.

However, this Q is not about the TEAM winning games, it is about a given pitcher being credited a win.

TEAM wins are vital.

Pitcher's wins are long-established and traditional but no less silly for the historical weight and baggage accorded them.

Pay attention to this distinction, do.

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I wouldn't get rid of wins - it's fun to watch pitchers chase down 20 wins in a year or 300 in their career, even for someone as steeped in modern statistical analysis as I am - but I don't use them as an evaluation tool.