American canine hybrid club, Papering and recognition of hybrid breeds?

Unless those dogs are crossed with cats or something, they are NOT hybrids.

A hybrid is a cross between two different species (e.g. hybrid wheat), or two species with different chromosome numbers (e.g. mules).

So right there, that club is shyte.

Add: To Shilo - by your definition of "Hybrid", a human child with two parents from different "races" could be termed a hybrid. Sorry, I'll stick with the actual scientific definition of hybrid.

I think it's crap. It's a gimmick that unfortunately many uneducated (read gullible) people will buy into. They'll spend a couple hundred dollars on their "designer breed" dog. Backyard breeders will continue to fill our shelters with excess animals, all in the pursuit of the all powerful dollar. It makes me sick, and I think the jackasses that came up with it should be horsewhipped. Add: Sad thing is, even Animal Planet is getting in on it. They have a show about dog breeds, can't remember the name. The spotlight a breed, and tell all the pros and cons. Sounds good right? Well, about a week or so ago they spotlighted "labradoodles". Great, so now even more idiots will be convinced that a labradoodle is a real breed, instead of the mutt that it really is. Nothing wrong with mutts, I own 3 of them, but I didn't go out searching for them. I wonder if they list my lab that's mixed with shar pei? Guess the fact that I got a "hybrid" for free was a good deal, huh? Ugh...and this is why I dislike most people.

I didn't read a lot of the answers, or click the link... but I do know there are trends leading to the registration of "hybrids".

My only REAL problem with this "movement" is the inability to hold any of the animals to a breed standard of any kind.

How can there be rules and regulations on breeding, when there's no way to differentiate a "good" specimen with a "faulty" one? There will be no skeletal standards, no way of going, oh maybe I shouldn't breed this Yorkie-poo, it has an irregular spine.

What about as the lines go on and on? Yorkie-poo X Yorkie-poo will make puppies that don't look like Yorkie-poos. They'll be "second generation", and it will be interesting.

How do you hold it to breed standard? Imagine the standards... Something like this:

The animal must be between 8 and 20 lbs. Ears either upright, or floppy, white or black, small or large, coat either curly or straight or any variation. Colors, white, black, sable, fawn, brown, or any variation thereof...

What is the animal being bred for?

I'm at a loss as to how you can improve the breed, when there's no way of finding out what you're even working with. It's challenging. And frustrating.

Designer breeds are not hybrids according to the definition of the term (a hybrid is a cross between two closely related species). A dog crossed with another dog is not a hybrid it's a mixed breed. An example of a true hybrid is a mule (donkey x horse).

I don't think ANY of the designer breeds should be recognized because there are thousands of them in shelters around the world for FREE, and we shouldn't encourage people to "shop" for a living creature and over pay for a mixed breed they could adopt the same animal at a rescue.

ADD: Shilo, yes many of the definitions you gave are true, a hybrid is a cross between two genetically different parents--two dogs do not fall into this category. Every definition you gave supports the idea that designer dogs are NOT hybrids. It is unwise to quote terms you simply look up and don't truly understand (in reference to your genetic definitions), since this is misinformation.

I do agree that mutts are great dogs and increasing their appeal would help them get adopted, but do not think "papering" all dogs is the answer, since this just increases the bottom dollar and not how many end up in shelters.

I also do not believe dog breeds with no job should be encouraged--what is the advantage of a labordoodle? Is it a retriever like the lab and smart like the poodle? Then why not just pay $50 and adopt the mutt at the local pound instead of paying >$500 for the fancy name??? Both the breeds I rescued have a purpose for being bred, and as a whole any organization that supports puppy mills (which is what designer breeding is) is not going to get any form of my business.

ADD: Great answer Working Dog! How can you set standards for something designed by nature to be variable! More often than not, you have non-standard parents being bred, which results in even more variability! Mutts are great, but they should be marketed as such and those who do have them shouldn't sell them. .... grrrr.. BYBs!

ADD: Owned by AmStaff I wasn't aware of the websites you listed but the GSD x pug really sent me into a fit! Could you imagine the health problems those dogs are probably going to have! Can they even be born without assistance??? Sorry for the rant, but I have a GSD and a Border Collie (those bothered me too, but the pug mix is just absurd).

ADD: Loki! Glad to see you're back in action! I agree 100%, it is misinformation if you collect your "research" from a site hocking the product your finding out about!

Having been a volunteer for a while myself, in both rescue situations and vet clinics, I also agree that mix breeds are prone to health conditions the same as poorly bred pure bred dogs. If you take a poorly bred pure breed dog and mix it with another poorly bred dog, the likelihood of the puppies having no genetic disorders is VERY slim, mix or not! Even if the parent's don't exhibit/express the disorder, that doesn't mean they aren't carrying the genes.. and lets face it, how many BYBs get vet screenings before mating their dogs. .. grr.. makes me mad just thinking about it!

ADD: Attached are the two places many of the designer breeds end up, since most people only see the cute puppy and don't think about the characteristics of the breed they are purchasing.

Those are not hybrids! A hybrid is 2 different species. Those are just mutts. BYB's and puppy mills trying to make as much money as possible. A hybrid for example would be a wolf crossed with a husky. That site is a scam!

This is ridiculous!!!

Just another way for BYB to make money.

Are they breeding for the betterment of any particular breed? NO!

It makes me sick what people do to these poor dogs, all in the name of money.

A dog should not be bred for looks or a cool new breed name. Dogs should be bred for the betterment of their breed and if someone wants just a companion mutt, then they should go to a shelter and pick one out, instead of giving BYB insane amounts of money for the same guys getting euthanized DAILY!!!

We should give all the mixed pups at shelters "designer names' and "Hybrid dog registration papers" so that maybe all the idiots out there will adopt one of them instead of paying the cause...

Sorry for my rant. Makes me so mad to see all the dogs at shelters and rescues these days, pure bred and mixed alike.

Just freakin' ridiculous, actually. That is the only comment that came to mind when I was looking at the photos of all the "hybrids"..Blah...

Oh, and, for some reason, the reality show "Living Lohan" was on at my house yesterday. Who knows why? Anyway, Lindsey's little sister called a pet store and asked if they had any of the micro-mini Maltese puppies left. Irked me....don't know why I shared that, but, I did......ANYWAY!

It just gives validation to these unscrupulous money hungry pigs who are systematically destroying the integrity of reputable breeding. Churning out more and more dogs that will end up in shelters and euthanized. This line is my favorite:

*OTHER HYBRIDS WILL BE ADDED AS DEMANDED BY BREEDERS.

PLEASE NOTE: The first breeder to create a new hybrid cross has the opportunity to name it if chosen to do so. If the breeder does not choose to name a new hybrid, our office will do so. Once a name has been selected, that name will be used for all successive litters of that particular hybrid.

BARF BARF BARF!!!!!!!!! Anyone stupid enough to buy into this garbage should be forced to stick toothpicks under their toenails and kick a wall.

Bravo, Loki....BRAVO! You deserve a beer!

Shilo seems to have no idea what in the world their talking about! Before talking out of ones a$$ research is always a great tool but misinterpreting research- now that involves talent! It takes a bit to make an old lady smile at the ignorance of human kind and that about does it :-)

Loki wolf child has really covered this very well. Theres no need for me to echo his or her answer.

~Prya's Riot

HAHA!

thats absurd!

a hybrid is 2 different species.

this is a registry for MUTTS. just to justify the rediculous amount of money people insist on charging the poor fools willing to pay for a MUTT!

Another for-profit, scam registry preying upon the uneducated for the benefit of the puppymill. What's to debate?

They're so clever that they named themselves the "Canine Hybrid Club" -- when "canine hybrid" is a misnomer that anyone with a working dictionary can figure out.

ADD: Note that two of their (3 total?) weblinks lead to the Missouri Pet Breeders Assn. (Puppymill capital of America), and the USA Breeders website -- which is largely utilized and moderated by someone with the nickname USDABreeder, and includes a "puppyswap" and "farm animals" forum.

Need I say more?

ADD: Shilo, you want to debate usage, as someone who makes their living with words I find nothing more "vile" than someone who criticizes others' knowledge of the English language, but still can't manage appropriate punctuation.

Your second definition of "hybrid", BTW works against you:

"In transmission genetics, a hybrid is the result of a cross between two genetically dissimilar parents. The offspring of unlike parents."

All breeds of dog are essentially genetically identical -- its the expression of those genes that creates different characteristics.

The first definition is pointlessly broad -- as Kip's Mom says, unless you want to start calling mixed race children "hybrids", you may want to drop that one, too.

I see your agenda, and it doesn't make sense coming from a rescue person. Your vitriol toward purebred breeders would be better served aimed at the asshats who create mixes on purpose -- how many "designer" dogs ("papered" or no) do you see sitting in shelters? I've seen plenty.

And the whole "mixed breeds are healthier" thing? Give me a friggin' break.

http://www.westwinddogtraining.com/hybridvigor.pdf

http://www.alldogsgym.com/content/view/280/

http://www.parispoodles.com/hybridvigor.html

Why would I possibly go to an *insurance company website* for information on dogs? Especially when I worked in vet clinics long enough to see that just as many mixes came through our doors with genetic health problems as poorly bred purebreds.

Are you talking about pet health insurance websites? Pet health insurance is a niche market, which includes a tiny percentage of the total population (1%-3% in the US).

http://www.avma.org/onlnews/javma/mar07/070301a.as...

http://vetmedicine.about.com/od/pethealthinsurance...

Use bunk statistics to make your biased point, much?