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What sorts of dating techniques do scholars use to date a Biblical text?
If Genesis 1-11 is viewed primarily as an oral tradition rather than actual history (which I believe most scholars would agree with), how can we corroborate the events that happen in the rest of the Torah?
How can we even prove that people like Isaiah, Daniel, Ezra, and the other Old Testament "prophets" even existed, or if their books were even written at one time by one person, without the original documents? To construct the current Old Testament, aren't we really just going on bad Greek translations made 3-4 centuries after the events happened?
We of course have corroborating documents like the Dead Sea Scrolls, but those are dated using dreaded carbon-14 data (which is of course only accurate when proving the Judeo-Christian tradition).
So basically, do we have a definitive chronology of the Old Testament writings, whether they were written by single authors and not changed in translation later on?
Also (kind of unrelated), are there any specific and accurately-dated "prophecies" in the OT that you find compelling. I mean, Isaiah 52-53 supposedly describes Jesus, but it really could descibe anyone delivering a captive people from dominance. And who's to say it wasn't a self-fulfilling prophecy (Jesus took on the characteristics prophecized in old writings to be more effective), or one that was amended at a later date?
I'm an atheist, but open minded.
Thanks in advance for any answer you can give me.
3 Answers
- username_hiddenLv 71 decade agoFavorite Answer
Here's a few thoughts for you. Sorry if they are a bit rambling: but its getting late where I am, and bed is calling.
We do not have a full chronology of the Old Testament but we can construct at least a partial chronology by cross reference to other historical sources. This is easiest with the more recent books, such as 1 and 2 Maccabees which are quite clearly historical and make frequent reference to independently attested characters and events. The older historical works are harder to pin down, as our independent sources are more patchy and there are fewer points of contact. However major events such as the Babylonian exile can be dated with some precision.
Deciding when the biblical books were written is harder than dating the events to which they refer. It would help if they all came with a brief author's preface, like Wisdom does! One of the main criteria, at least for establishing a relative chronology, is to look at the language used. This can help because some words come into use (loan words from other languages, for instance) and other words become archaic over time.
Another way of approximately dating books is by internal details. If, for instance, a book refers to an iron object, then we know it must have been written after the start of the Iron Age. If it refers to God's temple then we know it wasn't written before Solomon built the first temple.
Another general clue to the relative date of the books is how advanced the theology is in them. Revelation was a gradual process and some ideas emerged only gradually. The idea of resurrection, for instance, only appears quite late in the Old Testament and many of the earlier books focus instead on Sheol, or the grave.
Authorship of the books is usually determined on the basis of literary style. Many of the shorter books, such as Ecclesiates, read as a coherent whole and it seems reasonable to assume a singe author. Others (Isiah, for instance) are thought to show the hand of more than one author.
In answer to your question about whether the texts we have have changed much, its interesting to note that when the Dead Sea scrolls were found and compared against the modern texts of the bible there were remarkably few changes found to have occurred. This is perhaps less surprising if you think how many copies would have been made and circulated. If one copy had an error in it the chances are that someone would notice and be able to double check against another copy ('It says here I shouldn't covet my neighbour's asp. That's not what I remember - could I have a look at your scroll? Ah!, not asp, ***!')
Note: If you haven't heard of some of the books I refer to above, remember that there are two versions of the Bible. The Catholic and Orthodox churches use longer versions of the Old Testament which contain several books that the Protestants discarded at the reformation. These books are often referred to as the apocrypha.
- EdsLv 71 decade ago
Slave,
I have no problem with dating techniques as long as they are not used to "date something older then the materials that they are using". I do not believe that Carbon 14 dating was used to "date the Dead Sea Scrolls for Christians nearly as much as they were others who were interested in checking their authenticity for museum status. I do believe that when such articles are placed beside other articles which were all hand copied for centuries and we find the material matches exactly that it does help corroborate their usefulness. The Bible also has been dated using references of other historical matters that are known and documented to have happened.
Additional Information:
Prophesies of the Messiah that were fulfilled in JESUS:
Found in: Fulfilled in: Description:
Genesis 3:15 Galatians 4:4 Seed of a woman
Genesis 12:3 Matthew 1:1 Descendant of
Abraham
Genesis 17:19 Luke 3:34 Descendant of Isaac
Numbers 24:17 Matthew 1:2 Descendant of
Jacob
Genesis 49:10 Luke 3:33 From the tribe of
Judah
Isaiah 11:10 Romans 15:12 Descendant of
Jesse
Jeremiah 23:5-6 Matthew 1:1 Descendant of
David
Ezekiel 37:24 Matthew 2:6 Will Shepherd HIS
People
Isaiah 9:7 Luke 1:32-33 Heir to David’s
Throne
Psalms 45:6-7 Hebrews 1:8-12 Anointed
Psalms 102:25-27 Hebrews 1:8-12 & Eternal
Micah 5:2 Luke 2:4-7 Born in Bethlehem
Daniel 9:25 Luke 2:1-2 Time for HIS Birth
Isaiah 7:14 Luke 1:26-31 Born of a Virgin
Psalms 72:9 Luke 2:8-15 Worshipped by
Shepherds
Ps 72:15; Isa 62:3 Matthew 2:1-11 Honored by Great
Kings
Jeremiah 31:15 Matthew 2:16-18 Slaughter of
Children
Hosea 11:1 Matthew 2:14-15 Flight to Egypt
Isaiah 40:3-5 Luke 3:3-6 The way was
prepared
Malachi 3:1 Luke 7:24 & 27 Preceded by a
forerunner
Ps 2:7; Mal 4:5-6 Matthew 11:13-14 Preceded by
Elijah
Proverbs 30:4 Matthew 3:17 Declared the
SON of GOD
Isaiah 9:1-2 Matthew 4:13-16 Galilean Ministry
Psalms 78:2-4 Matthew 13:34-35 Speak in
parables
Jeremiah 7:11 Matthew 21:13 Temple a “Hse of
Merchandise”
Psalm 69:9 John 2:17 Zeal for Temple
(not GOD)
Deuteronomy 18:15 Acts 3:20-22 A Prophet
Isaiah 29:18 & Luke 7:22 Blind, Deaf, and
Lame are
Isaiah 35:5-6 Healed by the
Messiah
- NightwindLv 71 decade ago
The primary tool is linguistics. The way people write a language changes over time, and since the books of the Bible were supposed to be copied word for word, archaic word usages remain included over time (so long as you have a significantly old text to begin with, before translations happened). Historical and cultural references are also useful. For example, there are many things in the OT that can only have been written after the Bible after the Babylonian Captivity. (The most obvious being the mention of the Babylonian king Nebechanezzar)
Thus, we have a pretty good idea when the various books were actually put to paper, but we don't know how long they were passed along orally before that time.
Good translations of the OT do not come from Greek versions. They come from Hebrew versions, which is the original language of the OT.
I doubt the prophecies of Isaiah were amended, because the book also remains a part of Jewish scripture. Since Jews don't believe Jesus fulfilled those prophecies, they would have no reason to change the text.