Hey Xtians,you condemn idol worship,what's the Holy Family statues doing in church?

Catholics are Christian.......................not Xtian.

Next question?

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Ferdinand..........".the real Christians"............LOL!

So if someone takes flowers out to their grandparents' graves and sits there to pray, which one are they worshipping -- the grandparents or the headstone?

Most people will say, "We aren't worshiping either one. We're honoring the memory of people we loved while they were on earth."

And that is precisely what we Catholics do when we look at a picture or a statue of someone who lived a holy life and is now in Heaven. We are remembering what they did and asking God for the same kind of love, faith, and hope that the Saint displayed on earth.

Catholics know Who God is and why He deserves all of our worship, honor, and praise. I'm sorry if Protestants haven't figured it out yet.

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". . . not we the real Christians. . ."

Was "Learn of Me for I am meek and lowly of heart" was left out of Protestant Bibles? That would be the only possible justification for such arrogance and self-righteousness. But if it *is* still in Protestant Bibles, perhaps a few passages from Luke's Gospel are in order here:

Luke 18:10-14 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.

The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

We don't worship the Idols, we worship God. The Nativity scene represents the birth of our Lord. Its Him alone we worship. When we pray in front of them, we are praying to Almighty God and thanking Him for dying for our salvation. We vanerate God with the Candles and the Flowers. When a person dies and you put flowers in his/her grave, do you then venerate the stone or the grave? Of course not!

Okay 1, only Catholics actually do anything to statues, and 2, they don't actually worship them. Any image of Jesus or anyone is not to be worshiped, but to serve as a reminder.

Statues and icons are not worshiped. We worship only God. Images are used to remind us of the stories of faithful witnesses (Hebr 12:1) who have gone before us and have earned the appreciation and emulation of Christians. (We are not offended, BTW, by "Xtian" - it is an ancient usage to represent Christ by X.)

Veneration and worship are two entirely different things. Veneration is giving honor to those to whom honor is due, according to the command of the Apostle Paul: "Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute [is due]; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour." (Rom 13:7) . Worship is "worth-ship" - expressing to God his worth to us as much as we are able. His infinite worth is impossible for us to express fully.

We ask for the intercession of the saints in the same way that we ask other righteous believers to pray for us, also at the command of the apostles: "Confess [your] faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much." (James 5:16)

Blessings.

/Orthodox

I'm certain the Xtians you are referring to are the Roman Catholics and not we the real Christians. As we know it is prohibited by God in the Bible, we certainly don't have graven images.

Statues are devotional aids. In churches that use statuary, the art merely directs the mind toward higher spiritual thoughts. People aren't actually worshiping the statues.

Exactly...

(Exodus 20:4-5) “You must not make for yourself a carved image or a form like anything that is in the heavens above or that is on the earth underneath or that is in the waters under the earth. 5 You must not bow down to them nor be induced to serve them, because I Jehovah your God am a God exacting exclusive devotion, bringing punishment for the error of fathers upon sons, upon the third generation and upon the fourth generation, in the case of those who hate me;

OR A FORM LIKE ANYTHING...

This covers statues of jesus and Mary.

So simply it is wrong.

(John 4:23) Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshipers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for, indeed, the Father is looking for suchlike ones to worship him.

Spirit and truth does not involve STATUARY.

The Catholics got most of Christianity wrong. They bow before idols, wear idols on their persons, added books to the Bible, place priests between God and men and withheld the word from the people for the sake of power.

There is a whole history of hatred and rejection of the Catholics that has been suppressed and whitewashed over .

Bear with me as I try to make my point. The very first true Christian church had a beginning but over a period of many years one certain denomination "the Catholics" began adding to and taking away from those things which are written in the bible. Like an ever growing government it got bigger and bigger and got out of hand. They began making their own laws and rules but their control was challenged by "true" Christians who were immediately executed for voicing against the Catholic church that they were adding to the gospel of Jesus Christ (biblically a very serious offense). The Catholic church needed something more to keep a hold on people making them think they were still God's authority on earth so they began the ornamental-ism, the pomp and splendor whereby they might snake fascinate those who believed in God and desired control over them. They made all kinds of statues of different people and made new rules for worship and other protocols. Because of the great pretentious and elaborate props they hoped this illusion of being religious would help to authenticate their religion. It's all about power and control.

Now imagine the true bride of Christ, the true church with no props, no pretension just a quiet spirit believing and trusting God. The true church does not need ornamental-ism. The bible calls the false church the Great Whore. Think of how a whore has to be dolled up with make up and jewelery to cover her ugliness.

The true church holds the teachings of the bible because it is God's Word and they reverence His Word.

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Side note; You see how a person who calls himself "Illuminator" uses scripture references WAY out of context to try to authenticate his point. I have read in the bible where Jesus said call no man Father, meaning spiritual Father and yet Catholic Priests demand and prefer you call them this. Once when challenged on this question a Catholic Priest wrangled around some words and in the end justified himself being called Father completely going against the word of God. You will find that these haven't the Holy Spirit so they misuse and abuse the Word of God. Also they have set up catholic Priests to be the mediators between God and man and have set up the confessional completely bypassing and getting in the way of what Jesus had already done. These sinful Catholic Priests have no authority to forgive sins of any kind at any time!

1Ti 2:5 For there [is only] one God, and [only] one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,

1Ti 2:6 Who gave Himself as a ransom for all [people, a fact that was] attested to at the right and proper time. 1 Timothy 2:5,6 Amplified

Mat 7:21 Not everyone who says to Me, Lord, Lord, will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father Who is in heaven.

Mat 7:22 Many will say to Me on that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name and driven out demons in Your name and done many mighty works in Your name?

Mat 7:23 And then I will say to them openly (publicly), I never knew you; depart from Me, you who act wickedly [disregarding My commands]. [Ps. 6:8.] Matthew 7:21-23 Amplified

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@m92

Why then do you kneel, genuflect (do the cross thing) as you are kneeling before a statue which is usually located at the end of every aisle? I used to be a Catholic and the greatest sin in the Catholic church is refusing people access to the Lord Jesus Christ FOR REAL by not preaching the TRUE Gospel and instead you don't teach the scriptures but let people go through a sinful Catholic Priest as a mediator between God and man. These Priests have no power to forgive sins through the confessional and are deceiving people. Did you know that the Catholic church at some point will okay the teachings of Islam? Pope benedict has reportedly already signed documents stating that the Lord Jesus Christ is NOT the Messiah. This is a SIGN of the last days and the final forming of the great Whore the bible speaks of.

The Fool

Denying the existence of fire does not keep a man from getting burned by its flames.