Why are so many breeders so ignorant or indifferent to the importance of early socialization of puppies?

That's a good question. It is possible for a responsible breeder to socialize a puppy while they are still in the litter. Some do this as a matter of course, but you are correct in stating that the critical period for puppy socialization is the first three months.

I've always recommended that people get puppies between 8 and 12 weeks of age, but if the longer they wait the more they should be convinced that the breeder understands the importance of socialization.

I recommend socialization classes for new puppy owners starting as early as 8 weeks of age. I recommend to breeders that they begin socialization exercises themselves at 7 to 8 weeks of age. A good breeder with experience can socialize a puppy or a litter by following the guidelines in the attached paper on socialization.

It's a process of education. For more on the topic, see below.

Breeders of chi`s and other toy breeds often state they keep their puppies well beyond 12 weeks. Its apparently done because the dogs are fragile. I confess I find it strange - and if nothing else, it seems to explain the many obnoxious fear biting chis I run in to. I question this - are the dogs on life support - are they on IV - what exactly is so precarious in life at that time that the dog cannot be in another home.

Weird.

Anyway, while some breeders no doubt take their puppies to shows, or somewhere, I would never compare the socialization I could give one puppy to what a breeder will do with a litter of 5 or more. Sure, its better than nothing, but I have taken my puppy canoeing at 9 weeks, she is in stores meeting other people, in the bush, in a boat, walking down the street meeting other dogs, and even some basic agility (very basic). How can that compare to a bunch of puppies thrown in an xpen and left there at a dog show.

Breeders that claim they have dogs that are well adjusted (and still keep them past 8 weeks) are making that assertion based on their own standard. How can they say otherwise if that is all they have ever done. No doubt non-guarding breeds that do not display strong agonistic behaviours may fare better - but its still not ideal.

While dogs do learn throughout their lives, the critical period is between (about) 6 and 14 weeks of age - it is a window of learning that opens and CLOSES - and what is done, or not done, during that time will irrevocably affect the puppies development.

I`ve said it ad nauseum here, and it is true. Its be proven by Scott and Fuller (Dogs, the Genetic Basis). The brain CHANGES at 7 weeks, and it is a physiological period that has a finite end date.

IIRC, it was studies from a scientist (Skinner) on geese and imprinting that inspired Scott and Fuller to begin their school for dogs.

So, NO you cannot recover was is lost during that time. Of course, most dogs are moderately socialized during that period - so the perception of loss is very difficult to measure.

Why are breeders indifferent - because like the rest of us, they refuse to learn new things and are creatures of habit.

And conformation breeders as a rule, know nothing about working a dog, or having a dog outside of a ring. They develop a dog to perform a very narrow set of tasks with constant levels of stress. The dogs are localized, not socialized.

The other practicality is that not all puppies are sold at 7 weeks. So these dogs have to stay behind.

If I was buying a puppy to work in SAR, or in tracking, or in tactical defense, I would NEVER buy a 12 week old puppy. So much of what a puppy learns is hard to undo and training dogs for article searches for example require puppies that have not been punished for garbage raiding.

But when I`m in a market for a dog, choice is not always ideal.

Which is why I have often taken a rescue, its a dog with baggage, but its $300 - not $2500 -so I can live with it. In other words, a pet.

This totally depends on several factors.

In rescue - the dogs that we have problems with are the ones that have left the litter too early - however - these are always bred by the byb's who haven't known how to raise a litter correctly anyway, and pushed them out early because they cannot be bothered. They are then often sold on to people who haven't got a clue either, and know nothing of "fear imprint periods" in pups, and this can do more damage than CORRECT socialisation of a young pup.

So I feel personally that IF the pup comes from a GOOD breeder then the dogs will be correctly raised and socialised anyway and nobody should have a problem. If the new owner is a novice then it is better being with the breeder longer to do the job right. The only time I think a pup should leave at 6 to 7 weeks is if the new owner has the knowledge and experience to deal with those crucial weeks correctly.

I can see your point - however as much damage can be done in that 6 to 12 weeks as good if the new owner doesn't stay aware and puts the pup in situations it can't handle.

Rather 12 weeks from a good breeder than any weeks from a bad breeder.

Socialization is getting the puppy used to different people, animals and environments. It is important because if the dog does not get used to these things, it won't know how to act in social situations. Most aggressive or problem dogs have not been properly socialized. Socialization can be a little harder with a young puppy, but it is still important. You can start socializing your puppy as soon as you bring him home. Get him used to loud noises, all sorts of people and places, etc. You need to be very careful with a young puppy when getting him used to other dogs and places like parks, etc. Before the puppy has had all 3 sets of puppy shots you need to make SURE that any and all dogs he meets have been fully vaccinated. Also, do not take your puppy to places where dogs can go until he's had his vaccinations, this includes parks, pet stores, even walking down the street. After the 3rd set of shots, it will be safe to take your puppy most anywhere. Try to have him around as many other dogs (of all breeds and size), children, men, people of different nationality, etc. The more your dog is used to strange things, the better social skills it will have.

Many breeders who do wait, because they do know how critical this time period can be and choose to contol the experience a pup has during this critical time window.. so no big changes, scares and lots of additional time and training by the breeder..seperate time training and crate time..carefull exposure to sights sounds, places people.. not just a bunch of puppies in a pen, till they are older. so not all pups kept till older are kept by breeders fall into that catagory of ignorant.. quite the opposite really..

however it is true.. sadly a lot of pups are held back and not given the amount of time and work needed, and many bredeers have no experience or even worry or consider the importance of this early 8-16 week window..this is also often reflected in who they place their pups with.. so it is made even worse.. so if it is this kind of breeder then yup you should be concernd..however not sure I would want a pup from this breeder anyhow..

The real issue is, it is only during the 8-16 week window that they are most open and receptive to learning how to cope with stuff as a adult.... A dog with a solid temperment givin a propper amount of solcilization and learning during this time.. has the ability to accept new things even as a adult.. so they only loose it if they are not given experiences to keep the skill..

If they stay at the breeder or go off to a new home during this time.. and do not get carefully planned socilization, training in either place then the pup will possibly have issues, regardless if it was sold at 7,8,or 12 weeks.. this can be at a "breeder" who does not sell the pup till over 12 weeks.. or even that home that just fails to socilize that pup they do get at 8 weeks..till it is over 12 weeks or only worry or start to notice at 5-6 months that they start to think about training.

Some breeders keep them until 12 weeks or longer to see how their development goes as to being a show prospect, and keep in mind that some breeds are also cropped before going to their new homes. What makes you think that a show breeder doesn't socialize their pups? Some breeders take their litters along with them to dog shows and set up an ex-pen for them. I have been at both ends of the spectrum when it comes to this as I use to breed and have also bought from reputable breeders. In fact, my first two litters I bred would have been considered back yard bred litters by most people, and most of the pups in those two litters went home at 6-7 weeks. In the following litters, I've had a couple of pups that I've kept until 4 1/2-5 months old because I did not find the proper home for them and would not sell them just because of their age to just anyone. The last TWO quality dogs that I bought were also 5 months old when purchased. It made NO difference because of their age to me. I believe that *Greekman* will tell you that it's best to get a pup around 6 weeks old, and I will NOT argue with that for the reasons WHY he prefers a very young puppy. In fact, when mentioning the first two litters I had, there were NO problems with them being placed at the age they were, and I WAS in contact with almost every single puppy buyer for the life of the dog. I can see both pros and cons to your thought on this, BUT in MY case, whether being a buyer or a selling, it has had NO bearing on the outcome of the adult dog. JMO whether you agree with it or not. If it matters any, the breed I'm talking about is the Doberman Pinscher.

Because they are backyard breeders. They don't care about the animals, all they want is money. When people ask them questions about the breed they breed they just mention wonderful things about them, many which are made-up. Then the people didn't do further research and end up buying the puppy. Finally they couldn't live with the dog and the dog ends up in a shelter and gets put down. Simply because everyone is so IRRESPONSIBLE. It's a good idea to adopt one of these dogs out instead of buying from a puppymill.

that is a good question cuz the research i have done is the first three months are the most important for socialization and if it is going to be my dog for 10+ years, i prefer that socializing to be done with me ... i brought my new puppy to puppy kindergarten classes recently when he was 9 weeks old and all i heard was that was wrong, the dog was going to die of parvo, and on and on when a respected american veterinary group clearly educates that early socialization is key ... the worst even are the people who buy puppies and keep them locked in a yard until this socialization period is over due to neurotic fear of disease, only to have dogs with "separation anxiety", a dog that "play bites", or a dog that won't housebreak ... my entire life i have heard that 8 weeks is acceptable and i have even had a pup at 4 weeks who did just fine and lived a long and healthy life with zero behavioural problems ... my purebreed jack russell, the breeder wanted to keep till 12 weeks, i was outraged and basically had a friend go over and "get" my puppy on her 8 week birthday ... all i can say is they respond out of ignorance because i can see no benefit for a pup to stay with its littermates and mother for longer than 8 weeks ...

I have never noticed any of the known breeders on here say that about their dogs. But I personally know nothing about breeding apart from the fact that they should stay with the mother until 8 weeks. Apart from that, nothing! lol

As for the people doing it just for the money, aren't those the ones selling the puppies off at 5 weeks. Not keeping them for longer

I can only say that most of my puppies went home at around 10 weeks, or older. And further, none of my puppies had any problems as the result of staying with me for the extra weeks. And I did keep in touch with the majority of the people who had my puppies, for the entire life of the pups.

ps I did spend most of my time with my puppies, so they were well used to normal household sounds and activities. I have also bought in at just under 4 months, 5 months and 7 months and all these youngsters were perfectly well-adjusted individuals. I would suggest that if temperament is correct to begin with, most puppies would be able to deal with new situations without being emotionally unstable through lack of 'early socialisation'.