A student who doesn't try his hardest? What would you do?

If he's only at 7th kyu and the instructor is not promoting him due to lack of ability, then it sounds like the instructor is handling it. Leave it alone. I usually don't have this problem because most people who do not want to work eventually quit anyway.

Since this is a child, he very well may have some sort of medical issue that inhibits his abilty to learn a martial art.

If it is truly about a bad attitude, then just focus on the ones who want to be there.

One more thing: we like to say that the "martial arts are for everyone". Well, this is a good test of that slogan. Do you really believe that? If you do, then, well, grin and bear it. Teach him as long as your patience allows, then move on.

I had someone in my class that used to do that. The instructor awarded the person with various stripes and promotions anyway. I left that school. There is one in every bunch. There are two kinds though. The kind who really try and just need work.

If I encountered such a student, I would try to pay at least just a little bit more attention on him for a few minutes while the other students warm up, or go through Kata. (I got eyes all over the Dojo so there will be no slacking while my back is momentarily turned.) I would try my best to devote a few extra minutes and explain to him proper form and technique. And give him a few things to do at home as well. NOW, that's for an honest student.

For someone who shows no interest in improving, I would try the following.

Talking to him, asking his reasons for joining. You can tell based on the response. Sensei, "Why have you joined us young one." Student, "I don't know." Sensei, "Why have you joined us?" Student, "I want A B and C." Sensei, "Why have you joined us?" Student, "To learn Sensei."

As you can see. the response of the first student is a tell tale sign of disrespect for the art, and his fellow students. In such a case, the student either needs an attitude adjustment, (that I might not be able to give him.) Or needs to simply leave. Sensei, "If you don't know why you joined, than why waste your money?" "The door is right there." Student, "Psh! Whatevs old man, I don't need this stupid place anyway."

As you can see, some people you just cant work with. Other are truly trying, like the one I had in my class. But others are either there because their parents told them to do something productive, or they are just wise___s. Either way, one must look into the matter with a keen eye, and see truly what is stopping the student from performing their best.

EDIT: Plus too, it's not always the student's fault. I have seen some instructors overload students with techniques, and some just don't get it. The students are a reflection of the teacher. If the teacher is doing his part, the students will be a lot better. Of course like I said, some are just unworkable. Other may be suffering from lack of proper instruction. In such a case, I would look to myself.

If the student has not improved past 7kyu in several years then it is not much more than a baby sitting service. It is up to the instructor to motivate the student to try hard. You can do this by giving them some more personal attention, maybe some 1 on 1, but you also have to think of the other students. You can ask him does he want to train or sit down, you can give him pushups for not trying and other ways to increase his self discipline. You can say to him to have a break from training and come back when he is willing to try harder. You can also explain to him that in not trying in class he is wasting your time, the other students time and his time. You treat him with respect by teaching him correctly but he must do the same by trying his best. Do not try to hold on to one bad student and risk loosing more good ones. You can also modify the training to make it more fun and interesting but still teach correct technique and good exercise, that can sometimes motivate students to try harder.

This happens. You can attempt to correct that person, but you can't make them put forth the effort. The person has to want t do better too.

If they are trying I'll put in the extra effort. If I know or believe they have a learning disability I will put in the extra time and effort. But when the student doesn't care I will move on.

I have stop parents and asked them why are they bring this child. I don't believe this is what they want to do. I don't want to waste my time or theirs. I'll talk to my sensei about it too, he will get the final say. Now that I have a little more help I don't have to deal with it as much. I usually take the children and adults that are putting the effort in and the ones that are preparing for testing. I also have to take the blac belts an teach them separately.

Well first off what motivates one student and why they apply themselves to their training is not always the same for that next student. Finding that is key for this student and you I think and I have also had a student like what you are talking about here that just is not willing to apply themselves beyond a certain level for any reason.

I would sit down and talk to the student and see if you can establish their reason for wanting to take martial arts. Some are doing it because parents are pushing them to and just don't want to apply themselves much beyond showing up. Sometimes a parent will even use their child's attending class as a way of getting rid of them for an hour or two and having free time for themselves. Find out if the student has a real interest in taking martial arts and wanting to be good at martial arts.

If a student has a desire to take martial arts and be good at it then the problem might be that they are not discerning quality and seeing how their efforts are falling short as compared to others. In that situation you first have to then teach them to look at things more realistically and what they are doing as compared to other students their age and such. Occasionally they don't see the difference until you sit down and point it out to them while using several examples. That conversation should end with you telling them that you want to help them change this and help them to improve and get better because you believe in them and think that they can do and be better.

That last sentence is important in all this because sometimes students are literally afraid to apply themselves. In their mind its alright for them to not excel or be as good as everyone else because they are not putting everything into it and so they are not really failing then either. When I have a student like that I try to make them understand that is the wrong approach and they are better than that and have more talent and ability than what they realize. Challenging and applying themselves is the only way they will reach their fullest potential and that is what they should be doing rather than playing it safe by not trying. I also tell them that they are better than that really and I want them to apply themselves and that I will also be there to help them so that when they do have trouble or encounter problems in their training that I will be there to help them. Once you get them on this track then you only have to be there for them and giving them a compliment or two about their increased effort and progress and pretty soon it becomes more self-motivating for them to try and to be their best rather than playing it safe by not trying.

Sit down and talk with the student and listen to what they tell you and make sure its not what they know you want them to say and you hear but really the real reasons behind this and then go from there.

How does he do in sparring? If he really has floppy/sloppy techniques his sparring should be horrendous and he needs more practice with that.

Have you ever video taped him and shown him what he looks like? I do that periodically in my kid's class so they see where they are lacking.

How are you teaching him? Maybe he simply does not understand that while you don't run through your Kata at high speed the techniques themselves need to be fast and crisp. Another reason to learn Kata to understand the difference. Most people will either run through their Kata really fast thinking it makes the techniques faster but when they run the Kata slow the techniques are floppy too.

I had a student like that and it was quite exasperating but I kept showing him over and over. His father too was exasperated with the child and seemed very harsh with him telling me that the kids was simply not trying in anything. One day during training I was showing him again and he said: "I really don't know how". He understood what he was supposed to do but he simply could not figure out how to do it. Long story short that is where you as a teacher have to really stick to your guns and insist on him doing the technique correctly so he does not think he can get by with mediocre and more importantly you as a teacher will have to figure out how he is wired and get across to him somehow so he can understand. That means you have to be very creative in teaching. As it turned out the kid was trying harder than anybody in my class but because he could not figure out through regular teaching what to do I had to teach a little different. I am happy to say the child is getting better and even his father is impressed with his progress.

So, don't get frustrated thinking the kids isn't trying. If your student has been with you for many years it must mean something to him. Most "good" students don't last that long. Take him to the side after class and spend a couple minutes with him one on one and show him something. Send him home with instructions to practice and see if he comes back with it. Don't give up immediately after the first try if he does not come back with it. Try a different approach showing him the same thing again one on one until you find what makes him understand. Some kids are wired differently and they learn differently. They process things differently and in their mind they are doing what you ask. Sometimes actually show him what he is doing and then show him the right way. Be nice about it and don't embarrass him. Find also good things so he learns when a technique is good what it is supposed to feel like. These kids simply don't fit the mold of the majority and that is when it shows how good of a teacher you are if you can also teach someone like that rather than let them get away with sloppy techniques.

Is he a kid? Many children and teens who take martial arts are like this. Many people who do martial arts have never done any other sport. Traditional martial arts like karate often attract less athletic kids (the ones who are into anime and such) who have no idea what it means to physically push themselves or focus. My first instructor kicked everyone's *** on the first day (not literally - he just made us work out until we nearly dropped) to send the message right away that this was intense training. The instructor makes all the difference. This guy's instructor should have never promoted him with this type of work ethic.

Since he's showing up regularly and you do say he's practicing I would just let him alone. There are some people that just have some sort of condition, I have seen it in many of the ADD type of people, where they are interested but focusing is very difficult for them and takes up a lot of their energy just to try and focus on what they're doing. I am not saying he has obvious signs of being ADD but he may. Along with this kind of person I also noticed that yes it seems they're kind of "floppy" for lack of a better term but is not something they are trying to do. It is something that will eventually click with them but may take time. Probably the very best thing you can do for this person is be supportive and helpful if they're looking for help. Never discourage them, which is true for anybody in your class, because they are trying hard it might just be a little bit more difficult for them. It will click for them eventually and with support from the other people the class without ridicule they will hit that point much quicker. The fact that he's showing up consistently and is practicing means that his goal is to be very good at it. Be supportive and helpful and friendly as you can and he may just end up being the best one in the class.

Even if somebody is not advancing the way they should or maybe not trying as hard as they should doesn't mean you should turn your back on them. It may also be a self-esteem issue which is all the more reason to be supportive and friendly to the person. I don't know if your classes are filled with egos if so maybe this person just doesn't feel confident with the egos in the class. People jump to the conclusion that the person is just wasting everyone's time but if they're showing up all the time there may be a very good reason why they're not advancing or doing everything properly. Maybe they don't have anybody at home to practice with or maybe they lack the self-confidence which should be addressed by the instructor in a proper manner.

One of my old teacher had some students as you described and he dealt with it in a manner that seems to work well. At the end of each class, he would gather the students together and talk about various subjects. In this particular case, he would relate an ancedote about a classmate he had who though attended every class never improved and never took anything seriously. It would go something like this:

I could never understand why someone who would take the time to come to class, but never take his training seriously. It's almost as if he thinks being in class is enough or that he feels embarassed about being serious. Although he shows up every class, he never improves. And when my teacher corrects him, he does not listen or remember. In the beginning, many of his classmates tried to help him, but when they saw he simply was not listening or did not care they gave up on him and did not bother to help him further. He reminds me of some people I have met in life who just cannot seem to take anything serious and in the end have those around him give up on him. I wonder which is more embarassing: being serious and becoming a better person, or just coasting along without care and being regarded by others as a loser?

If the student does not get the hint, then it is obvious he is not worth the time to help.

what you mention is the way most students approach their training. Many people think they can just go through the motions and get good at their martial art. In all the years since I began teaching martial arts (since 1973), I find that better then 90% of the people I've taught don;t train properly or often enough. Many are what I call One Night Warriors. They come one night a week and go through the motions. They do no training or very little outside of class. They either think they are improving, or realize they are not and quit instead of fixing their problem. An instructor is a pointer of "The Way". He may be skilled and knowledgeable, but that does not make the student the same. Each person must pay the price of many hours of practice over many years to reach any level of skill. To do less is to waste your instructors time, and fool yourself.

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