What part of the illusion can we work with, and...?

I love how the Spirit works in our lives.

I stand in awe & gratitude of it.

The Spirit will take the things of this world that are designed to lull us to sleep & change them into tools to aide our eventual rejoining with the One.

When we begin to lose identification with the ego, the thought system of the world, our true identity in Spirit will begin to manifest as a very different "thought system".

As this happens we become what feels like a new person.

We are changed, we become more.

Because we are changed how we interpret what we perceive is changed.

Is it still illusion.

Yes, in the sense that misconceptions still cover our perception of Self.

But we have now truly begun the unlearning process, the uncovering of the lies & misconceptions we have blindly accepted for so long in time.

Paradoxes seem to be true simply because of this unlearning process.

Each level is a prep for the next layer to be removed.

Each level brings more clarity of vision.

Gen3:8-10

"And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden. And the LORD God called to Adam, and said to him, Where are you? And he said, I heard your voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself. …"

And man has been hiding from the love of God ever since.

May we all come Remembrance!

May we all awaken from fear to the clarity of vision.

Many Blessings!

I`m sorry Shiva. I gotta be naked to you. No other way I can do it now. Oh but you know that. Help me Shiva to tell you the right thing too. Know what I mean ? Sorry if this goes away from the question.

They say all this is Maya but Shiva without this Maya would I have known you ?

See Shiva the only illusion is in the interpretation of IT.

Illusion becomes when you move or been moved from your place Shiva.

In your place you are the Truth of love where love is not give or taken but happens.

In your place you are the Life where you are neither born or dead.

In your place is where all falls into place without explanation or reason.

Try it Shiva. It is easy. As bold as that sounds it is easy. Just try to do the right thing Shiva. Try to do it every time. If you try then even the Source will come searching after you lol.

Nothing much I can say really because it is you whom will be reached at the end and believe me you yourself is not an illusion. I know because I see you.

Salutations Shiva who has been my sister here for all this while. Salutations to your question and to your brilliant answers here.

Oh yeah one more thing Shiva. Even paradoxes has to meet somewhere. Go there and you shall meet the Others there too. : )

Be well always. Satyam Shivam Sundaram

an excellent, old question.

an apparent paradox. apparent, being the operative word. i think "a very difficult situation" is more like it.

i think there is a way out. but i'll stay a bit away from it here, and just address the dream analog to your actual question..

it is true that when we are asleep and dreaming we can become aware that we are dreaming and also use various aspects of the dream state to become what is known as conscious dreaming. it is an advanced dream control state. practice with the right tehcniques is required.

the same with the object of your actual question.

TQRP

The illusion of self as ego/mind can be used to our credit and God's glory only when we discover it is an illusion and thus a tool for when we are bound rather than the Self which is never bound. Even an incarnation of God is bound by the Ego/mind when It takes birth but it sees through the illusion and does not become bound but rather uses the earth bound ego/mind to teach and live from Spirit to set an example for how we are also to live.

Namaste'

Maybe its not an illusion. Ever think of that? I used to think the world was just an illusion until I concluded I have no reason to think that. I am therefore I am. A rose is a rose

The Illusion of "I", "ME" and "MINE"

to be worked on and changed to

"I am nobody who knows nothing and owns nothing"

Because nothing belongs to us not even, this body, mind, intelligence and this false sense of 'ego'.

We are the infinitesimal spiritual souls and we are eternal, full of knowledge and bliss. We have come here to experience what we already know conceptually and to remember that we are all made of same quality (spiritual beings) and have come from the same spiritual whole. Since we have taken this material body, we have forgotten our true nature, that we are spiritual beings having human experience and not the other way round. And our job here is to remember ourselves and remind others as we are all connected by the same thread, that is our Creator who we cannot see like in a pearl necklace where the pearls rest upon a thread which is invisible, yet it connects the pearls that we are.

Yes definitely it is a great conundrum but not at all a paradox, that is definitely we can find a way to come out of dream. The creator has kept a way to come out.

But for this a competent learned Guru must be there.

How can I meet my Master, the King, the Lord of the Universe?

Is there any Saint, who can bestow such celestial peace, and show me the Way to Him? ||1||Pause||

The Unseen Lord is deep within the self; He cannot be seen; the curtain of egotism intervenes.

In emotional attachment to Maya, all the world is asleep. Tell me, how can this doubt be dispelled? ||1||

The one lives together with the other in the same house, but they do not talk to one another, O Siblings of Destiny.

Without the one substance, the five are miserable; that substance is in the unapproachable place. ||2||

And the one whose home it is, has locked it up, and given the key to the Guru.

You may make all sorts of efforts, but it cannot be obtained, without the Sanctuary of the True Guru. ||3||

Those whose bonds have been broken by the True Guru, enshrine love for the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy.

The self-elect, the self-realized beings, meet together and sing the joyous songs of the Lord. Nanak, there is no difference between them, O Siblings of Destiny. ||4||

This is how my Sovereign Lord King, the Lord of the Universe, is met;

celestial bliss is attained in an instant, and doubt is dispelled. Meeting Him, my light merges in the Light. ||1||Second Pause||1||122|| {{{Guru Arjan Dev Ji Raag Gauree 205}}}

BUT THE TRUE (COMPETENT) GURU MEETS IF WE HAVE WRIT IN OUR DESTINY, AND SUCH A GOOD FORTUNE IS BESTOWED BY GOD AS A REWARD OF GOOD DEEDS OF KARMA'S.

The Guru is the True Banker, the Giver of peace; He unites the mortal with the Lord, and satisfies his hunger.

Granting His Grace, He implants devotional worship of the Lord within; and then night and day, we sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord. ||1||

O my mind, do not forget the Lord; keep Him in your consciousness.

Without the Guru, no one is liberated anywhere in the three worlds. The Gurmukh obtains the Lord's Name. ||1||Pause||

Without devotional worship, the True Guru is not obtained. Without good destiny, devotional worship of the Lord is not obtained.

Without good destiny, the Sat Sangat, the True Congregation, is not obtained. By the grace of one's good karma, the Lord's Name is received. ||2||

In each and every heart, the Lord is hidden; He creates and watches over all. He reveals Himself in the humble, Saintly Gurmukhs.

Those who chant the Name of the Lord, Har, Har, are drenched with the Lord's Love. Their minds are drenched with the Ambrosial Water of the Naam, the Name of the Lord. ||3||

Those who are blessed with the glory of the Lord's Throne - those Gurmukhs are renowned as supreme.

Touching the philosopher's stone, they themselves becomes the philosopher's stone; they become the companions of the Lord, the Guru. ||4||4||12||{{{Guru Nanak Dev Ji Raag Basant 1171}}}

The mind awakens illusion. One must use the mind to slay it. We are pure infinite consciousness which is neither mind nor body.

Your question, dear friend, implies that it is WE who are the dreamers and must therefore awaken. Surely, though, we are the dreamed, not the dreamer, and therefore awakening is not a matter of our doing anything but is rather a gift of Grace.

My thanks to Albert for an extremely interesting and unusual take on this subject, usually so obscure to the intellect.

a large part of me desires to be in control (about everything). i am becoming more and more aware of that. Even more so, there is little self-acceptance regarding that. Another interesting fact.

sadness.

muchos gracias.