Does anyone here know the truth about Josephus and Jesus?

Question

All the time I see atheists on here saying that Josephus isn't a source about Jesus. Usually they just say, "Josephus isn't a source for Jesus' existence because a monk forged that part."
However, it seems no one has done some basic research.
First, the text the atheists refer to as discredited is called the Testimonium Flavianum. It is a longer passage which contains information about Jesus' ministry, crucifixion, and resurrection. Now, most scholars do not consider it entirely authentic. However, they also do not consider it a complete forgery. The general consensus is that Jospehus did originally mention Jesus and the crucifixion here, but that the rest is a later interpolation. In fact, most scholars would consider the following reconstruction of the Testimonium to be close to Josephus' original:

"Now there was about this time Jesus, a wise man. For he was a doer of startling deeds, a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. And he gained a following both among many Jews and many of Greek origin. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him, are not extinct at this day."

Finally, there is an almost undisputed reference to Jesus elsewhere, when Josephus mentions the execution of James, who he says is "brother of Jesus, who is called Christ." Most scholars agree that this reference is almost certainly authentic.

Therefore Jospehus provides two likely solid references to the historical existence Jesus Christ. Why, then, do so many misrepresent the evidence?

Sources:
Joel B. Green "Crucifixion" in the The Cambridge Companion to Jesus edited by Markus N. A. Bockmuehl 2001 ISBN 0-521-79678-4 page 89
Jesus and the Gospels: An Introduction and Survey by Craig L. Blomberg 2009 ISBN 0-8054-4482-3 pages 434-435
Dunn 2003, p. 141.
Schreckenberg & Schubert 1992a, pp. 38-41.
The Jesus Legend by G. A. Wells 1996 ISBN 0812693345 page 48.
Painter 2005, pp. 134-141
Louis Feldman (ISBN 90-04-08554-8 pages 55-57) states that the authenticity of the Josephus passage on James has been "almost universally acknowledged".

WackoJacko · Accepted Answer

Because Josephus was writing years after Jesus' supposed death on the cross. Think of it as if a teenager today were writing on JFK's assassination, it would be hearsay at best.

EDIT: Did Jesus exist? Plenty of wandering preachers existed and Yehoshua (Jesus) was a common name. Did Reverend Smith exist? Yes, but so what?

? · Answer

Yes I do, Jesus is God in the Flesh. And Josephus was a Historical Scholar of his time. And a very accurate one.

God Bless Ya,
Chicago Bob	
imasinner

There is more joy in Jesus in one day.
Than there is in the World 365/24/7
I know, I tried them both.
Numbers 6:24-26

? · Answer

Now demonstrate that Jesus performed a miracle or was raised from the dead, which is what I really care about.  I have no issue with accepting there was an itinerant rabbi named Yeshua who got crucified for being an insurgent.  I care if you can prove the supernatural claims about him...can you?

And you can't just dismiss the fact that he wrote that decades after Jesus died since that's not what you're addressing.  Demonstrate that the Bible is not hearsay as well, while you're at it.

? · Answer

Even if Josephus did refer to Jesus, so what?  Jesus was long before Jesus' supposed time, so at BEST Josephus might be repeating 3rd or 4th hand, uncorroborated gossip with not attributable source.

Gomakawitnessofjesus · Answer

while josephus did speak about jesus, there is a historian named glenn kimbal who claims josephus betrayed the jews, (or christians)
one thing is sure, there are people on R&S who are complete "liars". alex jones says there are disinformation "agents" who are paid to lie. i believe a couple do post on Q&A. such people are guilty of treason and are traitors. there are athiests also who will lie through their teeth just to get people to not to believe in God.. such people are "criminals" without any conception of what eternal life is. in my opinion, all these types of people are "traitors"

Anonymous · Answer

Josephus is not a contemporaneous source. Anything that Josephus wrote is based on hearsay.
If you tell me that your unicorn sh!ts gold bangles, I might write that down. But it wouldn't make it true.
Josephus had nothing other than hearsay because he was BORN 37 CE, whim means he wasn't alive during the 'supposed' lifetime of the mythical 'jesus'.

There may be textual authenticity.. may be.. but there is nothing that would make anything Josephus wrote anything other than hearsay.

? · Answer

The entire passage is an interpolation, and has been widely recognized as such for decades. No amount of apologist literature and illogic will change that.

biggalloot2003 · Answer

It appears that you have set the bar for authenticity extremely low.

Are you afraid to require real authenticity?

? · Answer

Yeah. Me and him hung out Saturday nights at Pilates and got loaded.

shart of turin · Answer

Did you know that at that time the region was full of 'messiahs', performing miracles, preaching to the masses, and even resurrecting the dead? It was like Vegas, all the entertainers there.

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Does anyone here know the truth about Josephus and Jesus?

13 Answers