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Can the man made doctrine of "once saved, always saved" stand against the Old Testament?
The prophet Ezekiel said "And if the virtuous man turns from the path of virtue to do evil, the same kind of abominable things that the wicked man does, can he do this and still live? None of his virtuous deeds shall be remembered, because he has broken faith and committed sin; because of this, he shall die. (Ez 18: 24)"
Jesus agrees with this when He said that "those who persevere to the end shall be saved (Matt 24:13)"
For XY, there are things that we can do that are a sign that we have turned completely away from God. Catholics call this a "mortal sin" John refers to it as a sin that leads to death.
Consider the coldness of a person's heart in the following two situations:
1. If a petition to hire a female lifeguard for a swimming class is successful, the salary for that lifeguard would come out of a budget that would allow me to take a business trip to China. Because I want to go to China, I encourage a talk show host to speak against the petition.
2. Same situation, but I also spread rumors and personally incite hatred against the group that wants the female lifeguard.
3. Same situation, but I cut the brake lines on the car of the person who is heading the petition drive, resulting in her death.
All three of these involve sin, but the hatred in my heart increases and turns me further away from God.
Yes, Mona Lisa, it is called the "No True Scotsman" fallacy and shows why "once saved, always saved" is contrary to Christianity.
Yesmar,
Yes, salvation is by the grace of God. God does not withdraw that grace when we sin. We reject and throw away the gift of salvation when we sin as Ezekiel describes.
Amy,
Foreknowledge and predestination are not the same thing. Yes, being omniscient, God knows who will remain faithful and be saved and who will lose faith and not be saved, but God created each and every person with the intent that everyone be saved.
10 Answers
- James OLv 71 decade agoFavorite Answer
Not the OT nor the NT
OSAS is spiritually and morally dangerous by encouraging people not to repent of mortal sins or to have real conversion to Christ
- AmyLv 71 decade ago
The doctrine of Salvation deliberately rejects the Old Testament. Paul writes that no one can live entirely without sin, and so no one who lived by the OT could earn eternal life. Salvation is a gift of mercy, ie forgiveness for those sins.
"Once saved, always saved" refers to predestination. God knows who he will save, and those people do not break faith and choose to sin.
- XY GTHOLv 71 decade ago
Sounds good.
Given that, can you tell me when I have lost my salvation?
I don't want nebulous terms such as "backsliding" or "falling away". I want specifics.
Look at the following questions and answer them in the vein of when my salvation would be revoked.
What act?
What act committed how many times?
What * omission * of what act?
What thought?
You fill in these blanks and I'll start considering something other than OSAS.
Until then, all you've proposed is a shaky precipice upon which to build and grow my faith.
Don't just give me a TD and huffily walk away. Tell me.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
The entire concept of Christianity requires "once saved, always saved," because only an INSANE person would turn away from God once God has been revealed to them. I don't mean that as an insult, I mean it as an obvious, logical truism. How could one possible, willingly, choose eternal damnation after experiencing the full glory that is faith in the one true God? No amount of arrogance or any other human flaw could bridge that chasm. No person could possibly be unrepentant for their sins after knowing God.
Of course, that is one of the most basic fallacies and contradictions of the faith, and is an unavoidable result of nonsensical beliefs in make-believe omnipotent deities.
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- yesmarLv 71 decade ago
There is some merit to the "once saved, always saved" proposition. The problem with your theory against it is that salvation is based on grace, which is a New Testament idea, and can not be substantiated or torn down by Old Testament scriptures.
Source(s): I would disagree neighbor. We do not "lose" salvation by any means, especially by sinning. If that were true, salvation would be a "work" depending on us. Salvation is of Christ, it is all "him". We can not lose it, do something so bad that he would take it back, or anything similar. We can only throw it away ourselves, by completely understanding it, and then rejecting it willfully. We can not "slip up" and lose it. - Anonymous1 decade ago
Man does not live by bread alone, but by every word of GOD. Anyone that is saved by Jesus Christ and desires to enter to heaven, can not continue in their old sinful ways.
- moralorel79Lv 61 decade ago
It doesn't even stand up to the New Testament.
The verse that states "He who is first shall be last and he who is last shall be first" really blows that argument out of the water.
- 1 decade ago
Which 'Old Testament'; God's or Satan's??? God's the law of Moses (starts Ex. 20:3) or Satan's Genesis-Malachi.
- ChristineLv 41 decade ago
Couldn't have said it better myself. Once saved, always saved is not true, at least in my eyes.
- Aaron U.Lv 71 decade ago
Being saved isn't a free license to sin. After all, we STILL have to repent for sins even AFTER being saved. Are you telling me, you "don't" repent for your sins after he forgave you / saved you? Boy you have alot of un-repentant sins to answer for on Judgement day. No repentance = no forgiveness. God tells us to CONTINUE to repent after we fall short, AFTER being saved. This proves that we are STILL held accountable when we do "not" repent. This "once saved, always saved" lie is advocating that you "no longer" need to repent. Once forgiven, "always" forgiven? NOPE, only when you ask! The un-repentant are cast into the lake of fire, CLEARLY. Jesus died on the cross, making it possible to forgive / save mankind, if they simply ask for it. So the burden is on us in asking for forgiveness each time we fall short. And we STILL fall short (sin), even after God forgives you / saves you. And if you aren't asking God to forgive you anymore, then your heart is CLEARLY corrupt, and what comes from the heart God will judge. Once you are saved, you obviously STILL maintain a freewill, which includes the choice to choose Satan...
