sacredvanity

While science does not fall prey to the same traps as religion, and it can police itself, to a great extent, by proving or disproving scientific theories, observations, etc., does it in fact, for the vast majority of secular thinkers, become a new way of believing? Are we inclined, as non-scientists, to accept the answers that science gives us as capital t Truth?

I understand being skeptical of new findings. When I was a kid, a good breakfast was bacon, eggs, toast with butter and jam, and a glass of whole milk. Then they tell us that eggs are too high in cholesterol, bacon is too full of saturated fats, whole milk is too fatty, and butter is clogging our veins. They replace it all in our diets with margarine, skim milk, chicken and turkey and Egg Beaters, yet we still get fatter and fatter, we still die from heart disease like mad. Then we find out it was all pretty much an experiment in trying to curb heart disease deaths, and it failed utterly. Now the protein in bacon and eggs is good again, butter and whole milk are natural so they're good for us. It all seems an utter sham, at our expense. But science, for all it's screw-ups, at least can say when it screwed up. At least they can announce "hey, we were wrong. Sorry about that". So sure, I can see being skeptical of everything they say now. But what about evolution, gravity, germ theory of disease, vaccinations, planetary physics? These are well known, well researched, thoroughly backed up tenets of science that, although they are still debated to some extent, have never been debunked. Why do you refuse to accept them as fact?

You constantly attack our morality, our character, our intelligence, our sanity, our maturity, our sexuality, and anything else you can attack us on except the truth. I'm not saying we don't attack you. Certainly we do, but you see, we are the minority, and we know that you are our enemies. You are the enemies of truth, the enemies of reason, the enemies of tolerance and logic and humanism. I didn't make you my enemy. You chose that position for yourselves (and yes, I know I'm generalizing, that not all of you spew hatred, but you stand up to be counted with the enemy when you let them attack us and say nothing). So I get why we attack you. What I can't understand is why you attack us... You're the vast majority, you outnumber us a thousand to one. We don't threaten your way of life in the least. We aren't lobbying congress to take away your rights. We aren't controlling vast sums of money, influencing the economy, or controlling any major elected offices. So why? Why do you fear us so much?

What that guy did was not a result of his philosophical or religious views, and it doesn't prove or disprove God's existence or mercy or lack thereof. It isn't God's punishment, and it isn't proof that there's too much violence in the media.

It's proof that there are mixed-up, crazy, desperate people in the world that can and will commit violent acts against other human beings, with or without guns or explosives. That's all. It's not some clarion call to action for all the gun control advocates or the left wing liberal agenda, nor is it a chance for the NRA to defend the 2nd amendment once again, or for anyone to shout down the Bible to us because we're all wicked sinners.

Please, if you have any respect for those who died there, if you have an ounce of decency in you, stop using this tragedy as your own soapbox moment. Sit down, shut up, and just for once step outside your own personal prejudices and problems and realize that bad things happen, and sometimes we just can't stop it.

It seems to me, DowhatItellu2Do!, that you prove what so many atheists think about Christians to be completely true... that you don't want to discuss things, that you only want to spout your own opinions and beliefs about things and anytime you get an argument to your dogma, you're going to take your toys and go home like a 5 year old. I know not all Christians or believers in other faiths are like that, but it's people like you that give the reasonable ones a bad name, too. If you only want to talk to other believers, don't address questions to atheists. I get arguments and rude comments and Bible verses in answer to my posts all the time, but I have yet to block one single person. Grow up already.

Back in 2008's election, all we heard about was Rev. Jeremiah Wright, all day, all night. The message seemed to be that you didn't want to elect an angry black man who thought like Wright does. Now Romney, a member of the biggest cult in the U.S., is running for president, and nobody has even brought up his religion. Do you think it's just a matter of time, or is Mormonism going to be talked about only in hushed voices and behind closed doors?

If you think a few atheists in R&S disagreeing with you, and sometimes calling you out on your trolling is evidence of persecution, you're making Jesus roll over in his... well forget that, he's not in his grave, is he? Anyway, I keep hearing how you're being persecuted for being Christians. Please share with me the harrowing details of your stories of pain and torture and persecution. I'd really like to hear how hard it is to be a Christian, especially in America.

if we don't believe in God and heaven and sin, perhaps they would be the immoral ones without the constant threat of eternal torment? Why is morality such a conundrum to these people that they think unless it came from God-on-high that we can't possibly understand how to be moral creatures? Why do they think the animal world has no morality, either? When's the last time you heard of anyone other than human beings doing something immoral?

When I see pictures of Jesus holding the Constitution, I worry that we're putting our Founding Fathers on too high a pedestal. The document was intended as a way forward from what they saw as the oppression of a monarchy, not as a document that would forever be enshrined as perfection of government. When government fails to move forward at the same pace its population does, it has become ineffective, and I think that's what we're seeing now- polticians worried more about things like budget ceilings than about giving people their rights, making institutions accountable for theft and fraud, and ensuring the welfare of the common people. This isn't about Republican or Democrat, nor is it about white or black, straight or gay, rich or poor. Do you think, merely as a matter of politics in general, that we are making the Constitution too.... rigid in how we make our laws?

So people are telling me that Satanists are essentially Atheists. I'll admit I haven't done the legwork on this, and maybe if it's worth my time I will, but I wanted to get an easy answer first. So if Satanists do not believe in spirits or deities of any kind, why do they call themselves Satanists? Is it simply a reference to the meaning of Satan in that he is an adversary of God?

Every time I log into YA, I'm bombarded by people telling Atheists to explain how evolution works, or solve a math problem, or explain the Big Bang, or how the world began, or how life came from non-life, etc. etc. Why is the burden of scientific proof always posed to Atheists? Why do theists always expect us to know everything about science in order to justify our disbelief in God? Can theists answer every question about the Bible? Are they all biblical scholars? I admit it, I'm an atheist, but I don't know all the answers to every scientific question there is. I just happen to believe that science provides better answers than religion.

I'm just curious why religious people can accept certain parts of scientific theory as fact but not others, like evolution. Why would you accept that gravity keeps you on Earth, or that certain chemicals can cure disease, or that germs cause disease, or that the earth revolves around the sun, or any other number of scientifically deduced and tested facts and discoveries, but you reject things like global warming or biological evolution? Is this similar to the sort of "cherry picking" people do with the Bible, where you follow the commandment against murder and theft, along with hatred of homosexuality and abortion, but choose to ignore the rules about what foods to eat, what days to keep holy, the restrictions against wealth? And if you get to pick what you believe and don't believe, why then is it so wrong to so many that I don't believe the same things? Really, just curious to see if anyone can come up with a logical or reasonable or even passionately argued but persuasive rebuttal to this question.

Did I miss the part where it says "Go and spread my word by being a complete tool. Purposely misrepresent people's arguments. Ask questions over and over again that prove nothing and only serve to misdirect and obscure the point. Make false analogies between atheism and pedophilia, murder, and Hitler. Do all this and the non-believers will flock to the word of the Lord your God." Somehow I missed it. Could anyone please direct me to the corresponding Bible passage or passages? Thanks.

So if you really don't want a conversation but instead just want to make a statement about GOD or ATHEISTS or EVOLUTIONISTS or XTIANS you just put them in capital letters and hope everyone understands that somehow your question is sarcastic, right? Sadly you're only going to get about 20% of the readers to go along with you. But hey, worth a try right?

So in a post about Atheists being synonymous with Satanists, someone said that they are Satanists, they just don't know it. If in fact this is even possible, that Atheists somehow are promoting an agenda of non-belief in the service of Satan (who you would think would instead promote belief in Satan), isn't it possible that Christians, or Muslims, or Jews are also in league with Satan, and they're sending out false messages meant to confuse us and have us worshipping the wrong deity? Think about it.

It seems that whenever politics comes up in R&S, Christians invariably want the U.S. to be a Christian state (or claim it already is), and Atheists want it completely secular. I don't think we'll ever completely remove religion from the equation, but why try to promote a religious agenda within politics? You can't force everyone to belong to the same faith, or have the same beliefs? Do you really think you have the right or responsibility to even try to force it on an unwilling population?

Serious question, but a little odd perhaps. What is the Muslim faith's opinion/policy on foreskin? Do Muslims as a common practice engage in circumcision- cutting the foreskin from infant males (or males of any age, really), or do they view that as something distinctly Jewish in origin and practice?

So here's what I propose, since all this constant bickering gets us nowhere. Christians, choose a champion (one for each denomination, please, even the wacko ones that handle snakes and such), and Atheists will choose one, and Jews, and Muslims, Buddhists and Hindus... Your strongest, toughest, most kick *** servant of whatever stuff your religion (or lack thereof) is peddling as Truth. We put 'em all in big locked cage, and don't open it until one person emerges as the lone survivor. Then whatever that person subscribes to, deity or no, kind god or angry god, divine Christ or human Christ, that religion (again, or lack thereof) is now universal law. What say you? By the way, I'll be taking bets but will not be able to post odds until I see the contestants.

Alternately, we could make it a one-on-one tourmament style, but the logistics of that are really quite difficult and a free-for-all style suits my sense of justice, since the origins of them are really all just random anyway.

I just got finished watching Ben Stein's Expelled, which is about how the scientific community is trying to quiet anyone who is a proponent of Intelligent Design as a valid scientific theory worthy of research. And in this film, Stein goes to Germany to see places where the Nazis systematically put to death people who were insane or crippled because they were "drains on resources" in essence, and that he got this idea from Darwinism. But wasn't he really acting as an intelligent designer, remaking the human race to his own standards? After all, he thought of a "perfect race" of people, the end result of natural evolution, and he simply thought he was helping the process along. So he was, essentially, acting as an Intelligent Designer. So do the proponents of ID now have to ask themselves if they should hold up Adolf Hitler and the Nazi Party as one of the first real forces for Intelligent Design theory?

Sadly, I was posting an answer to your question Timur when I found out that it had already been deleted. I can't imagine why, when you so obviously wanted a thoughtful response to such accusations of douchebaggery on the part of Atheists.

But I really did want to answer honestly, just to say that we're predictable because a) you expect us to be, and b) you want us to be. That's why you post questions like "Is God real" and "Is Atheism a Religion", because you know full well that Atheists are going to respond to them. And you get to feel superior somehow because you know you got a few Atheists angry. Well guess what? Most of the people you are so disgusted with are already angry enough without being asked moronic questions, so of course they're going to give moronic answers. When you actually want to engage in a real dialogue with Atheists about religion and belief, try asking a more mature question. You'll be surprised at the maturity that answers it.